• Thank you for visiting HeavyEquipmentForums.com! Our objective is to provide industry professionals a place to gather to exchange questions, answers and ideas. We welcome you to register using the "Register" icon at the top of the page. We'd appreciate any help you can offer in spreading the word of our new site. The more members that join, the bigger resource for all to enjoy. Thank you!

Oil service

Noose

Well-Known Member
Joined
May 11, 2007
Messages
121
Location
Stony Plain
Occupation
O/O '98 378 Pete tandem dump ~~ '03 S185
How many hours/km of service do you run the oils(engine/hydraulic) in on your trucks.
I've always run the 3000 km mark / 250 hr which ever comes first.or is more applicable. If I'm idleing lots(ie. winter) I 'll watch the hrs. more.
Curious whether the syn. oils may be better suited for my 1 million km Cat cat.
 

thejdman04

Senior Member
Joined
Feb 6, 2006
Messages
582
Location
Illinois
I really think it depends on what the trucks are used for, otr service truck lots of idling etc. sometimes otr trucks we have go 10-15k miles before cahnges
 

Ford LT-9000

Banned
Joined
Nov 17, 2005
Messages
1,484
Location
B.C. Canada
Occupation
Rolling around in the dirt
How old is the truck ?

If its a older 3406E with lots of kilometers on it I would keep running dino oil with Delo and Rotella probably being the best brands out there.

If the truck has the C-15 and low kilometers on her I would look at the Synthetic brands that Delo offers or the Vavoline Blue Cummins uses.

Usually if the manufacture doesn't specify using synthetic it might be a extra expense you don't need.

With these new emmisions engines and the carbon they injest synthetic oil is probably better.
 

Bob Horrell

Charter Member
Joined
Nov 18, 2003
Messages
424
Location
Acton, CA
Occupation
Owner/Operator grading business
I do a lot of dirt roads and short runs so I change every 5K miles and use Delo 400.
 

surfer-joe

Senior Member
Joined
Mar 25, 2007
Messages
1,403
Location
Arizona
If you were using an oil sampling service, you could use either type of oil, and go untill you hit a threshold limit, usually determined by you and your sample report provider after a test run of samples and intervals. This could be way past what you would ordinarily expect, or, if you have an older engine (any component) that isn't doing well, it might be somewhat less.

If you run synthetic oils, you have to sample in my book. The synthetics are too expensive to use unless you sample and get the maximum life out of them, again at a point to be determined by you and your sample service.

But sampling is the only way to get the maximum life out of any type oil, simply changing at a specified interval is convenient, but you may be wasting oil and spending too much, or you may not be changing often enough. Without sample reports, who knows?

The same reasoning goes with filters. Premium filters may do a good job, but how do you know without sample reports?

I've gone both ways, and using sample reports to spot trends and problems is a very valuable tool. But I've changed thousands of gallons of oil by the number of days, weeks, months or hours, also by the gallons of fuel consumed by an individual machine. Using the last method can mean that even two identical machines can have different change periods because of the variables in the way they are used and the operator work methods. It is just about the most accurate way of changing oils short of simply going by the sample reports.

Too many people forget that there is oil in their transmissions and differentials, and some other compartments. They never check them till a failure occurs, they never change the oil, till a failure occurs, they never sample. Sampling these fluids a couple of times a year won't break you, but a sudden component failure just might.

Current engine oils are exceptionally good as are filters. I like the Texaco Ursa and Shell Rotella lubricants. But I've used Dryden (now Castrol), Kendall, Mobil, Gulf (Canada), Sunoco, and many others with good success. Wix filters are my favorite, available in many sub-brands like NAPA, Car Quest, Big A, etc,. I have used the Baldwin's, Fram, Purolator, Caterpillar, AC Delco, and many others with little problem.

You can play a bit with filters -- such as using one that has a smaller micron rating or perhaps one that has additional oil capacity, but you have to be careful and give complete regard to the manufacturers specs and directions. There may be a special reason why the maker does not use a certain filter, even tho it looks to be superior by the numbers. So beware.

I once changed engine oils for an outfit that insisted on doing it every one thousand miles, in their case, about once a week. That oil came out of their Cummins 400's cleaner than when it went in. Just about the only diesels I ever saw where the oil was not black with soot. On the other hand, I've seen some where it was changed once a year, whether it needed it or not. In neither case did the owners have a clue as to what shape their oil and their engines were in.

Generally speaking, I've not used much synthetic oil, mostly because of the cost, but also because it doesn't make sense to run it without sampling. I also have just not had a real need to use it as regular oil blends work nearly as well in most of the iron I've been around. Now some component manufacturers are using synthetics as factory fill for tranny's and diff's with a recommended change interval of one million miles. That's a long time and unless they are going to guarantee a full cost replacement warranty on those components regardless of miles, I'm going to check and sample for my own protection, as the best warranty in the world does not pay for downtime and breakdowns or road service in most cases.

One last note and it's off to bed for me. If you use a standard diesel engine oil and have a minor problem, say a small leak in the engine oil cooler. That cheaper oil may not protect your bearings or other parts and you could be faced with a mighty expensive O/haul. A premium oil may actually protect an engine that has swallowed an entire radiator's worth of coolant and kept on running till it overheated. I've experienced a couple of these and after fixing the problem (busted oil coolers), flushing the engine properly with a fine solvent and fresh light weight oil, then filling with the regular premium oil, found that no further problems were to be had and the engines ran just fine and showed clean on the next sample. If we had been running a lesser oil, I don't think we would have gotten off so easy.

Good luck!
 

LowBoy

Senior Member
Joined
Nov 23, 2006
Messages
1,149
Location
Southern Vt. on the Mass./NH borders
Occupation
Owner, Iron Mountain Iron & Equipment (Transport)
I couldn't have said it any better myself...:notworthy

SAMPLING. No substitute for this. Especially once the iron reaches it's golden years without any major failures, it pays dividends to see where you stand by a simple analysis report.

Just speaking out of personal experience, I recently sold a 1997 Peterbilt with an N-14 Cummins that I purchased with 565,000 miles on it. First thing I did when I got it home was roll rods and mains into it as a cheap insurance policy.
The bearings I removed could have been put right back up in, but what the hay...I was already there.
I sold it with 1,068,000 miles to a first truck owner. I wasn't the least bit worried about that engine, and am not the type of individual who would sell something to a working man or woman knowing it was going to give them a problem. I'd been through it completely recently, freshening up all 3 heads and all 6 cylinder kits, cam follower assy.'s, etc. It was in good shape.
I faithfully changed the oil at 10K to 12K (if I was busy,) and added a gallon of Lucas Oil Stabilizer in place of a gallon of oil. I sampled at every service, and detected only one problem, when I had a head gasket starting to fail and was gulping coolant into a cylinder. At that time I was a little busy and unable to address it right then, and it got the best of me. I shut it off one evening, and overnight as #1 piston was in the downstroke position, that cylinder took on coolant from the bad headgasket. In the morning I went to fire it up, and she said...UhUh. Hydraulic locked on the spot. A good friend where I was parked overnight lent me one of his Petes so I could go deliver my load 25 miles away, which was very nice. When I got back, I pulled my oil drainplug, and got a little antifreeze. I then drained the radiator down below the level of that #1 cylinder, and just slightly bumped the starter to get to compression stroke. After about 20 min. or so, it pushed what little coolant was in that hole out of the bad spot in the headgasket between cylinders, and it fired up as normal. I replaced the coolant, drove it home, and performed a total hystorectomy.
Point is, the problem was detected through the oil sample. The way I handled it was probably sub-standard in most cases, but that's another thread.:D
 

dumptrucker

Well-Known Member
Joined
May 28, 2007
Messages
205
Location
vermont
There is nothing like good oil.
I was up north near the border about 7 years ago with my boss. He had a 93 chevy diesel. We broke a valve spring. It was around midnight. We drove home at normal speeds all the way back with that broken valve spring. He brought it to the local dealer and they couldn't believe it, the valve was in perfect condition. They wanted to know what oil he used so he told them. They told him it was obviously very good oil.

Texas Refinery Oil Moly XL

What company do you use to do your samples?
 

surfer-joe

Senior Member
Joined
Mar 25, 2007
Messages
1,403
Location
Arizona
There are many good oil analysis services available across the country. Caterpillar is one that is available everywhere and is fairly consistent. Many are associated with the lubricant providers such as Mobil or Castrol. But even some oil companies out-source the analytical side of things. One company I've used for years was called CTC. It's now under a new name, but still provides the same quality services.

By the way dumptrucker, Texas Refinery produces some fine oils tho I never used their engine oil products. They make an excellent semi-synthetic gear lube that still amazes me with it's ability to lubricate heavy duty gear boxes and reduce heat and friction to minimum levels. It's expensive up front, but well worth every dollar in the long run.

Some years ago I had access to some oil testing results conducted by a surface coal mine in West Virginia where they ran oils as long as they could before changing them. The determining factors actually figured out to be a compromise because they were surprised at how long the oil held up before it tested too dirty to continue use. They were using some additional filtration and decided that they wouldn't run past 1000 hours on the engines even tho sample indications were such that they could have if they wanted to. This was in new Caterpillar haul trucks and dozers, etc. It was a large fleet and the savings was tremendous in oil consumption and cost.

On past jobs I sampled almost every compartment on every machine received on the project excepting light duty pickups and small generators or gas engines. New machines were sampled to establish the beginning trend line, older units were sampled to revel just what condition they were actually in as received from other jobs. Several contractors had a fleet wide program where every machine was sampled by the same lab so that long term trends could be established and followed. Very handy. Also very reveling as several times such testing exposed severe internal problems that would have cost a fortune to repair if they had been allowed to continue.

The whole point with oils and sampling, is that with good oils and filters, followed by a good system of sampling, you can extend oil and component life and reduce costs considerably. Oil never wears out, it just gets dirty and it does lose the additives that are put in to help fight corrosion and wear, so there is a point where lubricants have to be changed out for that last reason alone.
 

dumptrucker

Well-Known Member
Joined
May 28, 2007
Messages
205
Location
vermont
I know that Texas Refinery does oil analysis when you buy their product. I am hoping to start using their product next year as it is expensive. I think it is up around 900 or better for a drum of their moly xl oil.
They tell you when to change your oil from the analysis , but do tell you to change your filters at normal intervals. I know we used to get about 700 hrs out of our oil changes.
 
Top