Tow behind padfoot/sheepsfoot compactor

[ippielb]

I haven't done any work on the packer recently, got preoccupied in other things on the farm. Rebuilt a gear box on one of the swathers, investigated a leak on my excavator under the cab, found basically half of the nylon pilot hoses had pin holes and were all sweating everywhere. So i removed 23 hoses and replaced all of them. $1,400 birds nest, and the hoses outside diameter was slightly larger then the original ones so it was an absolute CHORE to replace all of them and fit them in the holders. But meanwhile doing that my turbo seized up, so i took it off and put it on the bench, there was a piece of rust scale that got lodged in the exhaust turbine. Priced out new ones, and the cheapest i could find was $6,000. So i cleaned it all up, hit everything that i could with the needle scaler to remove any chances of that happening again.

I also just bought at an auction the Hobart stickmate 160i welder, for 1/3 of the price at princess auto, its brand new in box. So going to get that tomorrow then i could try out DC welding.

 

[Welder Dave]

Let us know how much nicer DC is for welding. Only thing to watch is not exceeding the duty cycle. Usually doing a weld then chipping it extends the welding time quite a bit. Hook the stinger to positive for most rods, especially 7018 and 6010.

 

[ippielb]

That welder is TINY. Surprising how much power it can put out for being so small. Definitely different then AC welding. I'm struggling to weld overhead. Trying to re-do the welds on the underside of the cross bars on the hitch since it will be getting the weight from the packers while its lifted. Definitely smooth and on normal welding it does a good job. Trying hard to remember 30% duty cycle.

 

[Welder Dave]

Why do you make things harder for yourself? I think your plasma would have blown the holes through your mud scrapers but why not bolt them from the top? Much easier to weld. Put anti-seize on the studs.

 

[ippielb]

Why do you make things harder for yourself? I think your plasma would have blown the holes through your mud scrapers but why not bolt them from the top? Much easier to weld. Put anti-seize on the studs.

I definitely used the plasma to put the holes through, instead of piercing i just made a cut from the first hole to the second hole. Worked well. I made 20 mud scrapers, so i have scrapers on the back of the drums, and the front of the drums. 16 in total, then 4 spares. my three 36" sections of 3/4" all thread made me a few extra studs as well. Each scraper is held on with two 3/4" studs, a flat washer, a lock washer, and grade 5 nut. 32 of each. Let me tell you, it took me a LONG time at the bench grinder to taper the end of the studs and clean the threads after cutting them on the chop saw.

The scrapers are on the bottom because I'm trying to keep the dirt below the frame. Don't want the packer to get covered with dirt so if i can scrape it off below, be it on the front or the back, as long as its below the frame. Plus it just looks nicer with them below.

I ended up welding the studs to the frame with the flux core. Not critical for them to get 7018. But i'm going to have to weld the transport tire frame together using the 7018 and do some overhead, so i best figure out a way to practice. I cranked the welder up to 160 amps and tried it. I was surprised it really melted well. It's been a few years since i really welded stick.

 

[Welder Dave]

I meant you could have made the holes without starting at the existing hole. I don't think you needed double scrapers. Once any dirt is scraped off it won't pick up more until it does another revolution. It won't pick up mud from the top side. It depends on how hard dirt and mud get packed as too how strong the welds need to be. The flux-core you have is not good for your application. Keep a short arc for overhead welding and a slight weave helps control the puddle. If at all possible try to get it positioned for flat welding, especially where you need the highest strength welds. I bet your 973 would play with the packer.

 

[ippielb]

I tried, but i burnt myself way too many times trying to pierce through. The way i did it made it easier.

When people back up that's when the dirt would be coming around over the top. Either way, it got more weight and more cleaning on the drums. If i didn't use the flux core i'd still be underneath there welding on the studs, and having to die grind the droops of bead so the scrapers could sit flush. not enough room to get grinder in there. If they break off then i'll re-do them when they break with the 7018.

When overhead 7018, is it pull with a 10 degree angle?

Definitely going to be welding the transport tire frame together completely in the shop. I'll tack it together on the machine though. There will inevitably be the spot on the underside of the frame where i'll have to weld overhead for the brackets that the pins will go through.

 

[Welder Dave]

Weld overhead basically the same as you would flat. The rod has to be at enough angle that the arc pushes the the slag back from the puddle. 10 deg's. should be OK.

 

[ippielb]

For some reason i just can't get ahold of overhead. Vertical welding where i have access too i can KIND OF weld, i really stress the kind of part. So to make up for it i just did 6 passes, i wanted to practice anyways. Got some steel cut out for the transport tire system on the back. 1/2" steel plates, 2" hardened pins. some 3.5" 1/2" wall tubing and with a replaceable bushing. Definitely looking forward to being done this project.

 

[Welder Dave]

For your vertical welds weaving is easier than stringers. You could do the 1st pass with 3/32" and weave about a 1/4" wide. Then you could do a wider weave over top with 1/8" or even just the 3/32" rods. That's the great thing about stick welding, you can use smaller rods to make more difficult welds easier. Larger vertical welds are basically like putting horizontal beads on top of each other. Don't worry about how wide you weave either. As long as there's no slag inclusions you can weave as wide as you like on steel. There's a bunch of wife's tales that weaves should only be 2 1/2 or 3 times rod diameter, etc, etc. One of the main engineers who helped write the ASME codes told me he would challenge any weld procedure that limited weave width on steel. He said there is negligible difference in grain structure compared stringers or narrower weaves. For overheard practice on some scrap first to get the hang of it.

DONT put water in the drums! Only takes one Oops I forgot to drain the water before the weather turned cold. Weather can change in a few hours in Western Canada. Use windshield washer fluid or something else that won't freeze. The packer is already heavy, why the need to drain it anyway?

 

[ippielb]

For your vertical welds weaving is easier than stringers. You could do the 1st pass with 3/32" and weave about a 1/4" wide. Then you could do a wider weave over top with 1/8" or even just the 3/32" rods. That's the great thing about stick welding, you can use smaller rods to make more difficult welds easier. Larger vertical welds are basically like putting horizontal beads on top of each other. Don't worry about how wide you weave either. As long as there's no slag inclusions you can weave as wide as you like on steel. There's a bunch of wife's tales that weaves should only be 2 1/2 or 3 times rod diameter, etc, etc. One of the main engineers who helped write the ASME codes told me he would challenge any weld procedure that limited weave width on steel. He said there is negligible difference in grain structure compared stringers or narrower weaves. For overheard practice on some scrap first to get the hang of it.

DONT put water in the drums! Only takes one Oops I forgot to drain the water before the weather turned cold. Weather can change in a few hours in Western Canada. Use windshield washer fluid or something else that won't freeze. The packer is already heavy, why the need to drain it anyway?

I was hoping to be able to use water to make transporting the packer easier, easily drain the drums to alleviate the tongue weight. IF it has oil or diesel in the tanks, the weight is staying in there for ever, i dont want to deal with draining the oil/fuel out and making a mess.

Good to know about the vertical welding.

My issue for overhead is that the transfer from the rod never works out. I try smaller stick out and it bridges and freezes in the puddle. I'll have to get some more practicing done today.

 

[ippielb]

Little update, back has been in rough shape, wasn't able to do any work on the packer to finish the transport axle/wheel set up. Have steel cut out for the brackets, and pieces of pipe ready to go, just haven't gotten a good axle to use, still want a 10k or 12k trailer axle with electric brakes.

But in the meantime, i have used the packer to compact the entire building pad for our new shop, did a lot of with with it so far. And never had any issues, except the one nut came loose. Which i haven't figured out the way im going to secure the nuts from loosening.

I'll get a picture of the building pad and the trenches i've compacted with it.

 

[Welder Dave]

Darn, too bad you weren't closer. I just hauled 61 axles from a trailer shop to an auction yard and am helping to sort them out. There are a few 10K. Two are torsion axles with hydraulic brakes that were never used and worth about $2000 new. The owner of the shop wanted them gone and was going to send them to the scrap yard. The foreman and I convinced him they were worth more than scrap so he said we could have them and keep the money. There was also a large steel rack for them. It was cut into 6 sections I hauled to the auction yard. I think the auction starts next Friday and runs for 10 days. There's some good 7K axles as well, some unused. I can get some pics. and more info if you might be interested. Thought about taking them to RB's but they want a min. sellers fee of $150 for each lot. It would cost more to sell them than we'd get.

 

[ippielb]

Darn, too bad you weren't closer. I just hauled 61 axles from a trailer shop to an auction yard and am helping to sort them out. There are a few 10K. Two are torsion axles with hydraulic brakes that were never used and worth about $2000 new. The owner of the shop wanted them gone and was going to send them to the scrap yard. The foreman and I convinced him they were worth more than scrap so he said we could have them and keep the money. There was also a large steel rack for them. It was cut into 6 sections I hauled to the auction yard. I think the auction starts next Friday and runs for 10 days. There's some good 7K axles as well, some unused. I can get some pics. and more info if you might be interested. Thought about taking them to RB's but they want a min. sellers fee of $150 for each lot. It would cost more to sell them than we'd get.

I have had ZERO luck trying to find a good used 10 or 12k axle. That's what im really banking on to find. I wonder how much shipping would be on one of them. I really want electric brakes, so i can tow it behind anything with a electric brake controller and have the added braking capacity.

There's a manatoulin depot in Regina i can go to and pick it up. I had bucket teeth for my track hoe shipped that way from ontario or quebec and it wasn't too bad actually. Small pallet.

 

[Welder Dave]

I'm helping to catalogue them tomorrow. Should have had it done today but the guy wanted to spread them all out first. Then he's asking if I can tell if axles match just by looking at them. Some axles are 2" difference. Most are marked. I suggested taking a pad and writing the dimensions down so they're easy to match but he didn't quite understand why the pad and pen. I hope he takes some commision off for me doing all the work he should be doing. We want to try to get the most money for them.

I know there's some 7K unused with electric brakes but not not sure if there's a 10K with electric brakes. I don't think it's real expensive to add brakes. New 7K hubs with brakes and drums are $180. 10K are wider brakes but I can't remember the price. I'll see what axles might be suitable for you. I know there are 2 10K axle tubes with no hubs or anything that will go cheap because they're plain. The hubs and brakes can be added.

 

[cosmaar1]

Little update, back has been in rough shape, wasn't able to do any work on the packer to finish the transport axle/wheel set up. Have steel cut out for the brackets, and pieces of pipe ready to go, just haven't gotten a good axle to use, still want a 10k or 12k trailer axle with electric brakes.

But in the meantime, i have used the packer to compact the entire building pad for our new shop, did a lot of with with it so far. And never had any issues, except the one nut came loose. Which i haven't figured out the way im going to secure the nuts from loosening.

I'll get a picture of the building pad and the trenches i've compacted with it.

I’ll be honest I haven’t read this whole forum so not exactly sure what “nut” you are talking about, but couldn’t you tack weld the nut once you have everything tight? Sucky part is if you ever needed to take it off it would require you to torch it off, but it wouldn’t come apart again.

 

[ippielb]

I’ll be honest I haven’t read this whole forum so not exactly sure what “nut” you are talking about, but couldn’t you tack weld the nut once you have everything tight? Sucky part is if you ever needed to take it off it would require you to torch it off, but it wouldn’t come apart again.

So each drum has its own frame that's independent from the towbar frame. And in the middle of the front, and the back i created pivot points, so the drums can lean in either direction independently. Instead of using a pin(because my frames weren't perfectly true and square) i opted to use large bolts and nuts so i can tighten them to straighten everything out. I also put a bushing material inbetween the bolt and the frame so it will wear the bushing instead of the bolt. That thing was expensive.

 

[cosmaar1]

So each drum has its own frame that's independent from the towbar frame. And in the middle of the front, and the back i created pivot points, so the drums can lean in either direction independently. Instead of using a pin(because my frames weren't perfectly true and square) i opted to use large bolts and nuts so i can tighten them to straighten everything out. I also put a bushing material inbetween the bolt and the frame so it will wear the bushing instead of the bolt. That thing was expensive.

How big of bolt we talking? Maybe a nylon nut will keep it from backing out if it’s not super huge.

 

[Welder Dave]

I spent several hours today helping to catalogue the axles. I wasn't expecting to spend that much time and forgot to take some pics. Unfortunately there's only a couple options for 10K axles. There's the 2 axles with torsion suspension and hydraulic brakes listed seperately, but the same, and 2 10K bare axle tubes listed together. They should go pretty cheap like under $100 I'm guessing and maybe under $50. It all depends if someone is interested in them. New they are 16-$1700 each. They have 43" spring centers. Talking with the foreman at the trailer shop new hubs with drums and electric brakes for them are about $800 each. Then you need wheels and tires. If a 7K axle would work there is a new unused torsion axle with electric brakes. Thinking it should go for a few hundred $$$. A torsion axle may be a good option for your packer because it would provide suspension if you hit a bump or had to travel on a rough road. You wouldn't have to do anything too elaborate to make use of the suspension like you would with spring suspension. I asked him how much safety factor axles have but he wasn't sure if there's a specific amount. He did say axles are much stronger than their ratings. I'd say if your packer is under 10,000lbs. a 7K axle might work. I can't remember if your hitch takes any weight or it pivots up and down. You're not going to be pulling the packer all the time and you're not going to be going faster than maybe 50kmh on a smooth road. Just my thoughts though. If you really want a 10K axle it might be worth looking at used equipment and scrap dealers for an old trailer that's not road worthy but has a suitable axle. The last option I can think of is to buy some 6000lb stub axles from Princess Auto and make your own axle with heavy pipe or square tubing. Hope this helps. Let me know if you want some pics.

 

[ippielb]

How big of bolt we talking? Maybe a nylon nut will keep it from backing out if it’s not super huge.

I cant even remember what i used now, i think its a 2" bolt. So the head of the bolt is 3.5" i believe? The nuts were $180 a piece, with no option for nylon lock nuts.