I dare a dozer operator to show me a better floor grade

[IceHole]

Lol. I was just going to post asking you if you really wanted to go down this road lolol. Thanks for the shout-out. You look like you can make a hoe do skidder things. That's the fun part, when the guys bust your balls about making a site skidder-pretty with the 300.

I've tried blading skid roads with skidder. It's not easy! Pushing logs is cake in comparsion!

 

[CM1995]

You guys and your love for track loaders. A guy that works for me is originally from Indiana, and spent many years in Missouri. He has quite a bit of experience on track loaders. Everytime I ask him if we are missing out on anything by not having one, he tells me if I expected him to use a track loader for anything, he would quit, lol.

If I only had one machine to put food on the table it would be a track loader.

YMMV.

 

[aussiechunda]

I agree. About the only place they are used around here is at landfills, and to be honest I'm not sure how they are used there.

Are you guys talking about traxcavators? I dont think i have ever seen one in australia outside farming, if they made them the size of a wa500/cat980 i think they may be more common

 

[Oxbow]

I think track loader is the common name for them here.

As to size, I think a 973 is close to 70k? I could be wrong on that.

In my experience in Western U.S., they were more prominent up to the 70s when track excavators (hoes) were not as common and widely used as they are today.

My only experience with a track loader was with a 955L in 1977.

 

[aussiechunda]

I think track loader is the common name for them here.

As to size, I think a 973 is close to 70k? I could be wrong on that.

In my experience in Western U.S., they were more prominent up to the 70s when track excavators (hoes) were not as common and widely used as they are today.

My only experience with a track loader was with a 955L in 1977.

They seem like a very niche machine, A big loader does the same job better in basically every application.

 

[Oxbow]

They seem like a very niche machine, A big loader does the same job better in basically every application.

I suspect some have a different opinion on that.

 

[CM1995]

They seem like a very niche machine, A big loader does the same job better in basically every application.

Umm no.

A track loader will run circles around a wheel loader clearing a 1/2 acre lot, stripping the topsoil and cutting a daylight basement out.

A track loader can do all sorts of demolition and not be bothered with damaging tires.

I can load a 953 up on a tag behind a dump truck and move it anywhere. It's basically a large CTL.

Ya'll have track loaders down there. One of our best track loader wrenches on the Forum is from Down Under - Cmark.

 

[aussiechunda]

Umm no.

A track loader will run circles around a wheel loader clearing a 1/2 acre lot, stripping the topsoil and cutting a daylight basement out.

A track loader can do all sorts of demolition and not be bothered with damaging tires.

I can load a 953 up on a tag behind a dump truck and move it anywhere. It's basically a large CTL.

Ya'll have track loaders down there. One of our best track loader wrenches on the Forum is from Down Under - Cmark.

So thats the niche? Demo jobs if so makes sense why we don't see them in Australia, demo jobs are all done with escavators and skid steers, so its basically a big skid steer on big jobs yeah?

 

[AMBMike]

So thats the niche? Demo jobs if so makes sense why we don't see them in Australia, demo jobs are all done with escavators and skid steers, so its basically a big skid steer on big jobs yeah?

Niche
Noun
a place, employment, status, or activity for which a person or thing is best fitted.

You did an excellent job grading a smooth floor with your wheel loader.
I can almost guarantee that you either started on a cleared, hard, stable surface or you placed 4-6 feet of that material in one lift to support your machine.

The difference between a wheel and a track loader is the track loader can go into a swampy or wooded or stumpy area, drain it, clear it, push the slop off, and then place the fill and grade a smooth floor. It would be a nasty muddy mess but it can be done, and quite efficiently.

You say your demo is done with an excavator and a skid steer? We do that here also because we don't have track loaders.
A track loader can be moved onto a demo job, bring down buildings up to 2-3 stories, separate the recyclables from the demo, pile or load it on trucks or dumpsters, remove the foundations and paving, fill in the basements, and spread and grade topsoil over the site.

Clearing and stumping a rocky 2 to 1 slope? I don't think I'd want to try that with a wheel loader. In fact I'd prefer an excavator but a track loader works just fine too.

I'm not the only one who has done this. There are guys doing these things and more every day.

I don't think that meets the definition of "niche".

I've spent very little time on a wheel loader but I'll be the first to admit that on a hard stable surface loading from a loose pile they're hard to beat in loading and carrying. Get them onto something soft, or try to do anything that puts the tires at risk and they become very expensive.

My point is, everything you can do with a wheel loader can be done with a track loader, although it may be slower. Everything you can do with a dozer can be done with a track loader although it may be slower. Fifty percent or more of the things done with an excavator can be done with a track loader, some of them slower, many of them faster.

I'm not claiming a track loader is the answer to everything but with a track loader you can do many things that otherwise requires 2 machines or extra time. For a small company faced with an ever changing variety of projects it's like an answer to prayer, if you have a competent operator.

Lack of a competent operator can be the main drawback to these machines. They take much longer than an excavator, dozer, or skid steer to become proficient with. Learning the machine itself is less than half the education. Learning what it can do and how to do it efficiently takes even longer.

Not trying to step on anybody's toes here. I love a good debate so keep it going!

 

[Welder Dave]

They seem like a very niche machine, A big loader does the same job better in basically every application.

You are sadly mistaken. You just have to compare the strength of a track loader bucket to that of a wheel loader. I bet my 1yd track loader bucket is built more heavy duty than a 3yd wheel loader bucket. A track loader will dig in the same conditions as an excavator. Wheel loaders thrive on loading from stock piles or loosened material. Digging in hard packed clay, rocky material or clearing brush with roots and stumps would be a major hindrance for a wheel loader as would digging basements. A track loader would be right at home in these conditions and still do everything a wheel loader can do. A wheel loader is superior if you need to move material longer distances or travel between different work sites.

When I first read this thread I thought it was a little boastful but now I question the OP's credentials and intentions? How long have you been operating a wheel loader? You do know there are people on this forum that have decades of experience in all kinds of heavy equipment including operating wheel loaders, track loaders and dozers in any type of situation you can imagine. I think respondents to your post were just being polite because to answer your original question, a good finish dozer operator would put you to shame! Leveling off dumped piles of material on a basically level pad can be accomplished as good and even better than what you did with any number of machines. I could do it as nice or better with a skid steer.

 

[CM1995]

Niche
Noun
a place, employment, status, or activity for which a person or thing is best fitted.

You did an excellent job grading a smooth floor with your wheel loader.
I can almost guarantee that you either started on a cleared, hard, stable surface or you placed 4-6 feet of that material in one lift to support your machine.
HeavyMachinery

The difference between a wheel and a track loader is the track loader can go into a swampy or wooded or stumpy area, drain it, clear it, push the slop off, and then place the fill and grade a smooth floor. It would be a nasty muddy mess but it can be done, and quite efficiently.

You say your demo is done with an excavator and a skid steer? We do that here also because we don't have track loaders.
A track loader can be moved onto a demo job, bring down buildings up to 2-3 stories, separate the recyclables from the demo, pile or load it on trucks or dumpsters, remove the foundations and paving, fill in the basements, and spread and grade topsoil over the site.

Clearing and stumping a rocky 2 to 1 slope? I don't think I'd want to try that with a wheel loader. In fact I'd prefer an excavator but a track loader works just fine too.

I'm not the only one who has done this. There are guys doing these things and more every day.

I don't think that meets the definition of "niche".

I've spent very little time on a wheel loader but I'll be the first to admit that on a hard stable surface loading from a loose pile they're hard to beat in loading and carrying. Get them onto something soft, or try to do anything that puts the tires at risk and they become very expensive.

My point is, everything you can do with a wheel loader can be done with a track loader, although it may be slower. Everything you can do with a dozer can be done with a track loader although it may be slower. Fifty percent or more of the things done with an excavator can be done with a track loader, some of them slower, many of them faster.

I'm not claiming a track loader is the answer to everything but with a track loader you can do many things that otherwise requires 2 machines or extra time. For a small company faced with an ever changing variety of projects it's like an answer to prayer, if you have a competent operator.

Lack of a competent operator can be the main drawback to these machines. They take much longer than an excavator, dozer, or skid steer to become proficient with. Learning the machine itself is less than half the education. Learning what it can do and how to do it efficiently takes even longer.

Not trying to step on anybody's toes here. I love a good debate so keep it going!

Well said.

At one time our county has over 200 Cat track loaders that my PSR knew about. Countless others in barns and dirt pits scattered around he didn't know about.

Where a loader really shines here is basement home construction. 99% of our basements are walk out or daylight on at least 1 side.

Drop a loader off to take the trees down, buck the logs from the stumps, load the logs in the dump truck headed to the mill then get to stripping and stocking topsoil.

When the dump truck gets back from the mill, load the stumps and brush in the dump truck headed to the brush dump, then get working on cutting the basement out all the while building the turn around and driveway.

Upon completion the loader has -

Cleared the lot and loaded all the logs and brush out
Stripped and stocked the topsoil
Cut the basement out, building the turn around and driveway as needed
Loaded any excess dirt in the dump truck or spread out any imported fill needed.

When the machine is done (with one operator) the site is ready for the concrete guy to dig footings.

Can all the above be done with a wheel loader? Absolutely but not profitably. The track machine will do it in a fraction of the time.

 

[Welder Dave]

The OP sounds kind of like a first year apprentice who just got out of school and thinks they know it all. There are operators with over 40 years experience that still learn something new every week but don't boast about it. I'm curious how old aussiechunda is?

 

[Tones]

I had to do swimming pools and house pad excavations with a wheel loader, not as efficient as a digger but got em done. There was no other option.

 

[Truck Shop]

Character I worked with in construction, Guy Wise born in Weiser Idaho, scraper operator.
Was/is proficient with 621, 623 paddle, worked the gold leach mines in Nevada for a long
time.
We were working a stretch of I-90 in the basin, it was around 5 pm and I just arrived with
a sheep foot roller. Guy was in a contest with guys from the general contractor, don't know
what started it but--some money was held out on a bet, I knew what it was. Guy grabbed
a cold can of Lassie Beer and laid it on the ground in front of the frog, hopped up in cab
and rolled it about 300 ft without mashing it. He got out and collect his proceeds.

 

[bam1968]

It's been at least 2 years since the bucket has been on this.

 

[Welder Dave]

It's been at least 2 years since the bucket has been on this. View attachment 362771

How does that compare with an actual dozer?

 

[bam1968]

They are used around here to build terraces. We get most of the dirt for the terraces from the bottom side so we are pushing up a 2:1 slope. A loader set up like this is more efficient than a regular dozer because a person is able to leave all of the dirt on top whereas a regular dozer its nearly impossible to do so. There is a way to leave most of the dirt on top with a regular dozer some of the time but it involves backing up a little at the base of the terrace to loosen the dirt on the blade then shift back to forward to go up. So this involves hundreds of extra F to R shifts everyday that a loader doesn't have to do. The biggest negative I know of is it can be a little hard on final drives. Not so much on this particular machine (14X) but the older 11K 977's I believe had different final drives. There is a guy on FB that has a 963K set up with a quick tach blade with GPS that I would love to see in action.

 

[Truck Shop]

To go with my #54, the companies go to machines were two 953's one 963 two 215's
and one 225. The primary work was utilities and sight development for housing, large
stores, city/county work including schools, roads. Paddle wheel used for large acreage
along with grader. The 953's did a high percentage of work.

 

[Tinkerer]

It's been at least 2 years since the bucket has been on this.

The dozer style grousers had to of made a huge difference in the capability's of that loader.
It would be awesome to push sticky topsoil up steep slopes.
It was quite frustrating for me to push a full blade of topsoil to the top a 2/1 slope with a dozer, only to have most of it stick to the blade all the way back down to the bottom.

 

[Mr. Wrench]

I have never been around a job that had a track loader on it, so I don't know much about what they will do. I do know I have the greatest respect for a good dozer operator. I understand there is a place for Laser and GPS, but to me a good operator is one that can do a good job by sight and feel. A good rain will tell you how smooth the grade is. I think there would be alot of puddles is the picture at the beginning, that being said I don't think I could do any better.

One thing I have never been around and would love to see a good operator on, is a road grader.