Case 580b CK Torque tube top plate removal

[chuckiecage]

Hi everyone, so far this forum has helped me get the old girl stripped down to the top inspection plate for the torque tube, Here is the story on this just in case anyone wants to take a stab at what is wrong, it started when I bought this, it had a weird lurch that happened more when it was cold. it seemed to me that it was a missing tooth somewhere in the final drive because it felt like it was binding a little when it did it. it happened in both forward and reverse at almost exactly 1 revolution of the rear tires but never made any noise. not being one to ever fix something till its broke I let it be since I cant afford down time right now. then Friday it started making a weird noise in reverse I thought that was a hydraulic line banging underneath. my son tried to locate it but couldn't find anything and I am too smart to get under it while he is backing up with a load to check. eventually the noise sounded more like a gear that was spinning on a stripped spline but it would still go in reverse, I was trying to baby it so I could finish what I was doing but I believe it didst want to back up with a load. so I bit the bullet and tore into it first the rear end where every thing was fine then the trans, no obvious issues looking inside and fiddling around, cant see much in the shuttle but I did have it running with the covers off and the binding seemed to happen occasionally even with it in neutral the gears would spin free and then seem lock monetarily then free up, it seemed that it was coming from farther upstream in the drive train , the shuttle did not seem to be binding though but I believe it was too warm by then and stopped the binding, my thought is the reverse counter-shaft under the shuttle, I cant see it but has anyone ever heard of them going bad?? or if any one has suggestions on what to look for that will help now for the top plate, as I am of the experience that if it can happen it will happen to me, I am trying to remove the plate with the shuttle valve attached since I know that that little check ball will end up falling in the torque converter area and I will have to split the tractor to retrieve it, first is this possible, and if not what is a good way to catch it when I remove the shuttle valve, and the most important question nobody's posts that I have read have given suggestions on how to get the plate loose but I may have missed it too, I know there are 2 dowels that make it harder to pry up from only the rear wich is the only place I can get a chisel near it but with the loader on I cant even get a hammer in there to tap it let alone a chisel to pry it up from the sides. any help will be greatly appreciated, Thanks

 

[Brado4life]

I am trying to get the torque tube top plate off as well and I cannot do it yet. How did you end up removing it?

Thanks

 

[Coy Lancaster]

Welcome to HEF; You have a strange issue it seems, is this a power shuttle machine or a mechanical shuttle machine?
There isn't a reverse counter shaft in the torque tube just the shuttle and drive shaft from torque converter, or clutch, as the case may be.
To get your top plate off the torque tube and I'm going with it's a power shuttle and the plate you are talking about is under the fuel tank. You will need to take valve off of course and the separator plate as well. After removing the bolts you'll need to lift the steering column up to give you room to lift it up enough to get to suction tube and pump mounted on bottom of plate.
I'm sure someone has glued the plate with gasket sealer so I always used a 2x4 and a big hammer to loosen the plate. Hope this helps.

 

[melben]

Brado, there is a lower shaft directly under the power shuttle unit that transmits the power to the rear clutch, the rear gear is retained by a capscrew and a bolt and as I remember must be removed to slide the power shuttle assembly out. It serves the same function as a countershaft. I have seen the needle bearings fail in that shaft and mess up the casting but was always able to make a good repair. I am not certain as it has been many years since I have done one but if they are similar to the older 530 series as far as the top cover is concerned there was one bolt in the center of the plate that screwed down into the casting, as far as the valve is concerned I always used a thin metal plate to hold the spriings and balls in place on reassembly, putting the gasket in place with a little weatherstrip adhesive so it stays put when you pull the plate out after getting the valve in position, I have never dropped a detent ball into the trans case, maybe just lucky! Good luck, Let us know as you go along.

 

[Brado4life]

Wow thank you Coy and Melben for your reply. I have a 1970 580ck which I have been going through. Ive done too many things to list, but as I was getting ready to start using the machine to clear some dead weeds in Arizona, the machine starting to overheating and the machine stopped moving after 30 min of use. I believe the screen to the suction tube in the torque tube is clogged and I want to clean that before the Herculean effort to split the tractor. So yes it is a power shuttle with 4 speed transmission. My next chore is to remove the power shuttle valve and then torque tube top plate. Didn't know if I was forcing it too much, but sounds like once I get the fuel tank and steering column removed, then undo all the bolt and use some muscle.

I like the idea of a metal sheet to hold the spring and ball in place. I don't want to lose that .

My tractor is on vacant land about 25 min from where I live and I have a young family so I don't get there as often as I want. But I'll keep you posted.

 

[melben]

Noticing you said "ball and spring" there are one for each spool IIRC.

 

[Brado4life]

Success! Thank you gentlemen. I got the fuel tank and steering column removed. Then I was able to remove the power shuttle and it stayed adhered to the oil distribution plate so I didn't have to worry about the detent springs and balls. .

The torque tube plate took some good whacking it I got it off. I need to remove or loosen the piping that collects oil from the hydraulic reservoirs as it is exactly over the top plate and I cannot get it off as is. I called it quits for today at this point as I have already removed my old radiator and placed a new one and I was starting to get heat stroke. Over 6 hours in Arizona 114 degree weather. Whew!

 

[Brado4life]

Here's the gaskets for the oil distribution plate and the regulator valve. Going to purchase new ones as well as the adapter housing gasket (torque tube top plate).

How do I get them to stay when I put it all back together?

 

[Tinkerer]

114° .
Good Grief Brado !
You need to rig up a tarp for some shade. Doesn't look like the tree is much for shade.
Have a generator and fan nearby and out of sight ?
Nice progress tho.

 

[JL Sargent]

I tip my hat to you, working in that kind of heat. Keep up the good work, stay hydrated, make a shade.

 

[Brado4life]

Thank you guys. Didn't make it out to the tractor these past couple weeks, but I had brought home some pieces so I stripped them to bare metal and painted them. Can't wait to put it all back together.

My kids started in person school. So happy for it. Not sure how Covid has affected you, but all these regulations here in AZ have really hurt us.

 

[Brado4life]

Hey guys, I had to post this. I got the plate off the top of the torque tube and lo and behold the screen for the suction tube was completely clogged look at all this stuff that was down there. I was able to grab it with my hand. I'm going to flush out some diesel and then put it back together another day. I'm so happy I do not have to split my tractor to redo interior seals. Thank you guys all so much. I couldn't have done it without your help and all the previous posts on this forum.

 

[Bls repair]

Tinkerer “ But it’s a dry heat “

 

[jay4706]

How did you guys make out??? Did the filter screen clean up fix your issue?

I've been reading posts for months trying to figure my 1974 580b CK and only just realizing it's been 10 years since anyone has been chatting haha.

Short and sweet, sluggish machine, rolls forward in 1st barely in second. Better power on reverse but still sluggish. Always been like that since I picked it up in 2016 but it's been to cycles of hi Tran and it's actually worse now than it was.

I've done all the cylinder packs, pins and bushings, rad repairs, fuels and filters, most of the gauges, it doesn't have a trans pressure gauge.

After going thru all the posts I think my next move will be to locate a new pressure gauge and install it to check trans pressure, then start pulling it apart to the top plate to inspect the filter screen. After that a full split to the torque tube.

Parts are getting hard to locate here. Ontario Canada.

My first question, What sensor is the pressure and what it the heat? There's to little sensors coming from the torque tube top plate and both have been rotter off!

Thanks guys

Jason

 

[Mike Hupka]

How did you guys make out??? Did the filter screen clean up fix your issue?

I've been reading posts for months trying to figure my 1974 580b CK and only just realizing it's been 10 years since anyone has been chatting haha.

Short and sweet, sluggish machine, rolls forward in 1st barely in second. Better power on reverse but still sluggish. Always been like that since I picked it up in 2016 but it's been to cycles of hi Tran and it's actually worse now than it was.

I've done all the cylinder packs, pins and bushings, rad repairs, fuels and filters, most of the gauges, it doesn't have a trans pressure gauge.

After going thru all the posts I think my next move will be to locate a new pressure gauge and install it to check trans pressure, then start pulling it apart to the top plate to inspect the filter screen. After that a full split to the torque tube.

Parts are getting hard to locate here. Ontario Canada.

My first question, What sensor is the pressure and what it the heat? There's to little sensors coming from the torque tube top plate and both have been rotter off!

Thanks guys

Jason

I wish I had answers to your questions, but I just wanted to comment and wish you luck. I just got my '74 580B CK and finding clear answers for some of my issues has been challenging since most of the conversations are from the early 2000's at best, haha. Getting ready to swap trans fluid this weekend and hoping I have it figured out.

 

[jay4706]

Mines fixed! Torque tube screen plugged. So happy