Cat 215, some questions

[Nige]

I did try and buy a PDF of the full maintenance manual

They don't exist, as you discovered. The Cat Publication reference for the "genuine article" is SENR7421. New it sells for $745 in paper form or $530 on a CD.
I don't see one on any of the usual internet marketplaces but that could change tomorrow.

Do you still need the valve setting procedure?

 

[Dgreen4298]

Once you get the fuel system lines hooked back up priming that machine with the hand primer pump is nearly impossible. You can remove a line from the filter housing and use a hand suction pump on the line to draw the fuel out of the tank and then hook the line back up and use the machine hand pump

You're refering to the thin maintenance book, that covers the daily stuff, etc etc. Got it with the machine... and very glad I did. I also got a parts book, which has also been very handy. Amazing how much of that stuff (seals, etc etc) is still out there. Batteries are still charging from running them down yesterday, hopefully I can lure a buddy of mine over here to crank it while I bleed the injector lines later.

I did try and buy a PDF of the full maintenance manual from two different places online. One purported to be based in Georgia and an American company, and the price, while not quite when I would expect to pay for a paper manual, was close to $200.00. I got a manual from them, but it's a mishmash of cat service procedures, not well organized, and while the webpage stated it was for a 96L machine it was not. So beware, if you're looking for an online manual, that they probablly dont' actually exist. The other one was 1000 pages, and 800 of them were copied from a Cat site dealing with doing maintenance with the machine's computer. All I wanted to do was to read up on how to set the valves.

i see the 96L service manuals on eBay all the time. People buy them at auctions and think they are gold so the price is usually high

You can jumper the starter and bleed the injectors yourself, the starter is right there

 

[a65l]

Got the injector lines bled out today and the old girl fired up. Takes quite a bit of cranking before it starts and runs. I hate to have to hit it with ether, but I also hate to grind the starter forever. Still sounds rough untill you put a load on it, then it smooths out a bit, but after idling for a while it starts running rough again. It also quits smoking, but as it idles I see it start to smoke again. Any thoughts as to what might be the issue? STill running on the trolling motor tank, but I don't think the rate of fuel supply is an issue. New air filters now, too, so I can't blame it on an intake restriction.

I still see some seepage from #2, I think, cylinder injector connection, even after loosening and tightening it several times.

I ran it for about 10 minutes, and it didn't seem to get quite as hot today. I still need to get a thermometer and measure temps. Should have thermostat tomorrow, so I'll get that in and an official non leaking gasket. I think the material I bought isn't suitable for water connections, as I made a gasket for the thermostat housing on my truck and it seems to be leaking now, as well.

One other thing that puzzles me, there are wires over the cylinder head that I assume are for glow plugs. The crank switch moves outboard and works a solenoid, that I assume would be for glow. But I see no provision in the cylinder head for glow plugs... Might be hard to see in the included pic, but there's a conduit that carries the wires over the valve cover.

 

[Acoals]

How many hours are on this machine?

 

[a65l]

They don't exist, as you discovered. The Cat Publication reference for the "genuine article" is SENR7421. New it sells for $745 in paper form or $530 on a CD.
I don't see one on any of the usual internet marketplaces but that could change tomorrow.

Do you still need the valve setting procedure?

Thanks, I actually found a manual on the internet, it's cat form REG01348-01, 3304 and 3306 Vehicle Engine service manual. I haven't verified that the S/N is exactly the same, but it covers turbo/non turbo and the pictures of the fuel pump, etc, look just like my engine. It has valve adjustment procedures in it. I just need to come up with a way to turn the engine over without the starter so I can set TDC accurately.

 

[a65l]

How many hours are on this machine?

The hour meter showed 7400, but I'm not sure it was operating.

 

[Acoals]

There may be a big nut on the front of the crank. You may have to reach in and root around in the the gunk to find it, then you can put a long ratchet on and bar it over.

Usually those old machines have a lot of time. Without getting pretty deep into it and tearing things down you may have trouble cleaning up the smoke and rough idle and such. If all you are doing is digging a pond I wouldn't worry too much about some of that.

 

[Dgreen4298]

Got the injector lines bled out today and the old girl fired up. Takes quite a bit of cranking before it starts and runs. I hate to have to hit it with ether, but I also hate to grind the starter forever. Still sounds rough untill you put a load on it, then it smooths out a bit, but after idling for a while it starts running rough again. It also quits smoking, but as it idles I see it start to smoke again. Any thoughts as to what might be the issue? STill running on the trolling motor tank, but I don't think the rate of fuel supply is an issue. New air filters now, too, so I can't blame it on an intake restriction.

I still see some seepage from #2, I think, cylinder injector connection, even after loosening and tightening it several times.

I ran it for about 10 minutes, and it didn't seem to get quite as hot today. I still need to get a thermometer and measure temps. Should have thermostat tomorrow, so I'll get that in and an official non leaking gasket. I think the material I bought isn't suitable for water connections, as I made a gasket for the thermostat housing on my truck and it seems to be leaking now, as well.

One other thing that puzzles me, there are wires over the cylinder head that I assume are for glow plugs. The crank switch moves outboard and works a solenoid, that I assume would be for glow. But I see no provision in the cylinder head for glow plugs... Might be hard to see in the included pic, but there's a conduit that carries the wires over the valve cover.

Some of the 215 with 3304s had glow plugs and some did not

 

[Bluox]

Your pre-cups don't look like they are glow plug type as a glow plug will stick up as tall as a fuel line nut.
Bad Bob

 

[Dgreen4298]

You can turn the engine over by putting a chain wrench on the crank pulley,you will have to remove the fan cage. There is also a barring socket you can by but you’ll have to remove the starter to use it.

 

[Gary Layton]

Good call...a chain wrench on the crank is how the CAT tech turned my CAT 320 engine a few weeks ago when he adjusted the valves...he removed the fan shroud to get access.

 

[a65l]

And I just put that fan shroud back on.

If it's any help, engine s/n is 48V47221. And it's definetly a 3304. I couldn't get to the injector pump in the time I had so no S/N for it.

but I do have some pictures of the pump, if that helps...

 

[Nige]

Here's the valve setting information for that engine. SENR7424 is part of the main SENR7421 service manual.

 

[a65l]

Drained fuel tank today. I'm wearing very exclusive cologne tonight.



I just opened the drain valve, the small one. There was a teeny bit of gunk in there, I actually managed to pull the valve all the way out of the valve body without any leaking. Took quite a bit of poking around with a scribe to get it to flow, but when it started... Anyway this is after I managed to get the bolt back into the valve housing. I did have to stick a piece of wire up in there every once in a while to keep the flow going. About 35 or so gallons, I think... might be closer to 40. I think the dipstick showed over 3/4 tank.



Plan is to let the fuel settle for a couple days, then I'll take a transfer pump and rig the out put thru a diesel filter ass'y I just happen to have sitting around. I'll pump into another fuel container, and if it looks good I'll add it to my backhoe's tank. Actually, if it looks good I'll just put it right back into the excavator's tank. Well....





I've seen worse. I need to prop the machine up so that the large drain plug is in the lowest corner of the tank, then I'll just hose it out. There is a gap in the slosh baffle, so I can get to the other side fairly well. The pickup tube looks pretty good, I think I'll stick my borescope down it and see how it looks from the inside, but I think I got lucky there.

 

[Acoals]

Drained fuel tank today. I'm wearing very exclusive cologne tonight.

People spend a lot of money for worse smells .....

 

[a65l]

So the USPS managed to loose my paper manual, but I did find a site that had basic info for pulling the injectors. Looks very simple. So, question for the collective. Would I be better off to pull the injectors and pay to have them tested, or simply buy new valves and replace them? I'm not sure if I can clean them well enough here, I do see there is a small screen inside that could be holding crap. I haven't priced the parts from Cat, but I can get them on Amazon for about $25 each, might only need one or two but would probablly just do all 4.

Second question... while I have the injectors out it would seem to be a good time to do a compression check. Obviously I need some sort of adapter. Part number? OR recommendation for a good one aftermarket? A gauge in the right range is easy enough to find, and not terribly expensive.

I also note that one of the connections at the injector seems to be leaking, pretty badly. I loosened it and retightned while the engine was running, and let a good bit of fuel squirt through to hopefully move out any contaminants. I'll have a good look at it when the injector is out, hopefully the tube isn't boogered up, although they seem to be fairly easy to source and not terribly expensive.

 

[a65l]

Well, since I had a leaking injector line, and I had to disconnect it to clean the mating surfaces, I figured I might as well just pull all the injectors. I'll call Cat tomorrow and price replacements, I see that the nozzle ends are very carbon-ed up, and it's cheap insurance, really. I also see that the seals on the top of the nuts are very dry and hard, so replacing them is in order as well. I did actually finally find out that there are glow plugs in the precombustion chambers. I can't measure any resistance thru any of them so they may be burned out. I'll price those, as well. Pics..

 

[oarwhat]

Make sure to get the procedure to reinstall . Glow plugs have to be clocked to a certain position.

 

[a65l]

I won't be pulling the precombustion chambers, so glow plugs shouldn't move...

Called Cat today and got prices for the injectors.. nose bleed high. And then I gotta buy the seals. If the aftermarket parts were't so cheap I'd go get them tested and only replace what was bad, and I might still do that. But just sticking 4 new ones in there has some appeal, so I think I'll shop the aftermarket... I might be getting what I pay for, but they're not that hard to get to, and I am on a little bit of a budget.

 

[Acoals]

If you get to fixing everything that isn't quite right, you are going to wind up 50k into it. If that were mine I would get the fuel system patched up, dig the pond and get the machine shipped off to an auction before a $15,000 component takes a digger.