cold weather operation

[KMB83]

couple questions, stemming from the fact that i'm not used to running in cold weather. but a late fall never let me finish my field work.

1) frozen tracks.

i clean my tracks diligently at the end of each day. i'm getting tired of moving around my tires. if the ground is already froze solid and will not freeze/thaw while the machine is sitting on the frozen ground will the tracks still freeze down? normally the stuffs in the shed and i dont have to worry about this.

2) cold weather starts.

i let my machinery run for 30-60min before working it. my d6r has no glow plugs, but has the ether assisted starting. i have never liked using ether to start things. this is a factory installed system. should i use the ether system or do something else?

3)heater houser

i like running open operator bulldozers. cold is starting to change that statement. i've seen a machine with a little heater powered by the radiator coolant on machinery trader. i've seen heater housers. which is the best? the radiator powered heater, i've never found a supplier of said equipment. anyone know a manufacturer?

thanks in advance!

 

[surfer-joe]

OK, there might be some freezing on already frozen ground or ice due to the fact that if you have run the crawler during the day, the tracks have some, not much, but some residual heat built up in them. It should not be enough to bother really.

Use the ether -- sparingly. It's easier on the electric start system and batteries. The CAT installed ether systems are very good. But, you have to remember to keep ether filled cans in place, empty cans are useless. Make sure that the lines running from the can to the manifold in not pinched or broken and that the solenoid operates properly. Newer CAT systems have a thermostat connected in line with the solenoid and will not allow the ether solenoid to operate when the tractor coolant is up to operating temp.

You can spray ether into the air cleaner too, again, carefully. I have done this literally hundreds of times with no problems short or long term.

Trade the tractor for one with a cab. No?

OK, head down to the CAT house and ask the parts guys for a heater assembly that you can bolt on. (they have single and dual motor units available) Get some canvas and tie it down to either side of the cockpit area. Draw it up toward the seat on both sides, leaving just enough room to get in and out and operate. That one you saw in Machinery Trader may be very similar to CAT's and may be cheaper in cost and less sturdy too.

Winter fronts? I've made them and used them. Hated them either way. You have to have a blower fan for most of them. Then every time you thump over a rock or hard patch of ground the radiator and engine area shake off some dust and dirt and it comes right back to the cockpit into your eyes and face, along with soot, oil, and fuel vapors from minor leaks. There are some that just wrap along each side and the fan blows warm air (eventually) back along the sides of the firewall. Same thing as above. At the end of the day your eyes are feeling like you been in a dust storm, your nose is full of gunk (lungs too), and your face feels like it's been sandblasted.

Best bet, stay the hell indoors out of the cold and have another well buttered cinnamon roll with beverage of your choice. It’s bound to warm up eventually. The global warming stooges all tell us this is so......

 

[KMB83]

lol

good answer on the frozen ground. my tires were froze down the other day, and it was too late to get more.... i'll give you a report if this doesnt turn out so well.

logical on the ether. i just dont like the rattling/banging/roughness starting something with ether brings about. any yet cat wouldnt install something that isnt to be used. our mechanic only got it out as the last option.

and finally appreciate the feedback on heat. some old tractors around here have heater housers. they arent much force, but better than zero. hadnt thought about all the crap it would funnel towards you on a dozer. i looked in the attachment section of my manuals and didnt see cat making such a item, but i'll quiz the parts guy.

i do have the fan blades drawing air to the back. whenever i get off to pee and am behind the tractor, seems like most of the warm air is going under the seat and over the tranny.


and as far as global warming goes, i'm not ready to bet the farm on that.

30yrs ago there were chants of an ice age, give them time....

thanks again.

 

[RonG]

If you can find some wood of sorts,lumber,trees,even brush or a combination of rocks and brush to park the tracked machines on it can ease your mind somewhat.
Bear in mind that warming up the machine can thaw the ground and if you shut down again without moving it,allowing it to cool off might add to your problems.Ron G

 

[KMB83]

good point on starting and not moving.

i think with a week of 0°, the next time i'm gonna start the stuff up will be when the lowboy arrives.

i'm sure a northerner or two will chuckle at waving the white flag, but its harder on the equipment, harder on me, and the finished product isnt as nice.

 

[watglen]

If i regularly started my machines at cold temps i would have a small generator and bat charger in the truck. Plug in the block heater, hook up the bat charger, and start greasing. Have a coffee, read the paper. In about 1/2 an hour the engine will fire right up.

I do this when the machines are in the shed too, its close to the AC plug, and a tiny bit of effort eliminates hard starting completely.

As for the heater you are after, there is a store in Canada called Princess Auto. They have the heaters you are looking for, and like everything they sell, they are cheap cheap cheap. I have used these heaters before, they work well. Princess Auto in general is one of those places that sell the stuff the chinese won't buy themselves if you know what is means. Don't get too excited when you find 24" crescent wrenchs for $29.99! But if its fast and dirty you want, thats the place.

http://www.princessauto.com/truck-t...s/4240006-12v-auxiliary-heater?keyword=heater

They will ship to you.

Good luck

 

[hardtail]

I think thats good advice to move a bit on the warmup and shutdown........I sometimes will just put the blade down and lift the machine, 3/4's length of the tracks come up before starting out if I suspect something might be frozen down..........

Thx for the laugh SJ.......I would almost need a funny car mask behind my ol Internationals............LOL

 

[EZ TRBO]

KMB...Wisconsin here and when my family was still in the earthmoving biz we pretty much shut down once the ground got good and froze.

1. Unless you were just clearing timber, etc it is almost impossible to do good finish work.
2. Takes twice as long to do a half ass job. That said now I'm still stripping quarries but its fine for what we are doing, but still going to have to go to a few next spring to tidy up our fill piles, etc.

Just got our 6H back after a whole boat load of updates, etc and our mech installed one of them heater deals on the right side entrance. I've not had the chance to run it much but the one that has said it does a pretty good job. Have the CAT ether injection as well and like SJ said they work very well and with the little common sence of not using too much should not harm anything. One of my fave. ways to warm a machine up was one we used years ago when still crushing lime...waterlines from the diesel engine on the crushers to the heater lines on the pick up, quick couplers and run the warm water through the pick up engine and warm up the diesel engine before you even cranked it.

The boards under the tracks are a nice thing as well...nother thing i've done is on a day that is close to the 32 mark and the dirt is muddy is to go out to the machines few hours after shutdown and run the tracks back and forth a bit, the mud has crusted over and will fall out better.

Trbo

 

[D6c10K]

"...waterlines from the diesel engine on the crushers to the heater lines on the pick up, quick couplers and run the warm water through the pick up engine and warm up the diesel engine before you even cranked it. "


Sounds like a good idea for starting a tractor/dozer that only gets started ocassionally. What type of couplers did you use? Where did you connect it on the diesel motor?

 

[EZ TRBO]

D6c10K, the lines we used on the truck were the heater lines(both were early 90's models), not sure with the newer vechiles how it would work but I dont know why it still wouldn't, as long as you are running the same type of antifreeze. Don't remember where the crusher line was loacted at(Murphy Diesel), but on the dozers we just had a valve on the side of the engine that we could plug into. I'll look to see if we have any photos.

Biggest thing was to just keep an eye on your water levels in both machine and truck. I'll have to check with my dad or uncle on the type of couplers, I belive we might still have some of the set up at the shop.

Trbo

 

[EGS]

D6c10K, the lines we used on the truck were the heater lines(both were early 90's models), not sure with the newer vechiles how it would work but I dont know why it still wouldn't, as long as you are running the same type of antifreeze. Don't remember where the crusher line was loacted at(Murphy Diesel), but on the dozers we just had a valve on the side of the engine that we could plug into. I'll look to see if we have any photos.

Biggest thing was to just keep an eye on your water levels in both machine and truck. I'll have to check with my dad or uncle on the type of couplers, I belive we might still have some of the set up at the shop.

Trbo

My dad had a set up just like what your talking about on his log skidders.
I remember it hooked to the 1" heater lines, it worked real good too.

 

[KMB83]

Watglen,

thanks for the link on the heater. that little rascal might just do the trick

it doesnt have to been that terrible cold for a chill to creep into a man just sitting. the trick is to know the balance of what you'll be doing and to dress appropiately. too much = sweat = bad, too little = cold = bad.


EZtrbo,

point well taken on finish work/length of time. i hate to leave something half open. especially by the road..... but your statement is fair.

we'll see what happens to the chunks come spring thaw, how long it takes, whether it mellows out, etc.

some of what i was working on was adding a crown to a field road, see how that acts under tire traffic etc. luckily i had some unfroze ground to mix in with the frozen ground.

cool idea on the quick connect heat. i'm thinking we had a 1 in 50 fall/winter here and i dont want to get too good at this cold weather stuff.


in the end its all a learning process for me...

 

[RonG]

I used to wear the full length suit by Carhartt etc with the black insulation,not the red.They would keep me comfortable within reason,you only had to worry about your feet and hands then.The wind is always the killer for me,I HATE the wind.
That is why I do not wear the two piece suits because the gap at your waistline can work against you.
The one thing that you cannot protect is your head as you need visibility and peripheral vision as an responsible operator as well as a keen sense of hearing for the awareness that goes with the job requirements.As long as the wind is not blowing too hard and you have a reverse fan to keep the engine fuel filters from freezing you can perform in a pretty cold environment.Ron G

 

[grandpa]

Minnesota solution: Take a 5 gallon pail of water too jobsite. Everynight after shutdown, remove keys and install in bottom of pail. In morning retrieve keys and return to work. One morning keys will be inaccessible. About six months later keys will become accessible again....magjic. This solution absolutly eliminates any cold weather problems that I have ever encountered.

 

[KMB83]

haha...

the only problem is 6months is half the year!



the black carhartts are good.

head gear gets challenging. i have a facemask made by underarmor that is good at moving moisture away, and you can change the amount of face that is covered, eye slits to under your chin easily. then i put on a stocking cap over it.

pulling a hood over your head has yet to work well for me, to much side to side head movement and my ear protection is bulky underneath.

 

[tripper_174]

Grandpa..you are a very wise man!

For my head I use a beaver hat..I don't care what PETA thinks. Doesn't restrict vision or hearing if you use earplugs. Besides, with my hearing it doesn't make much difference! I use a fleece watchcap (toque up here) for under my hardhat unless it gets really windy then I use a liner. Still I prefer Grandpa's idea!

 

[bulldozer phil]

Our solution for cold weather starting (below freezing) is to use CAT factory block heaters-in the block heating elements. We have a Kubota powered generator pack -salvage from an RV-that we have trailer mounted and enclosed-20 gallon diesel fuel tank-we start it after evening shut down and let it run all night-keeps the engines warm and makes for easy starts-we do not use ether. We do not expect to run in extreme cold-starting temps below 20 degrees simply because our good IA mud freezes into concrete and it is difficult to break and hard as heck on equipment and operators. We don't have a lot of trouble w/freeze down-use the hydraulics to lift the tracks off the ground. Mud in the tracks is a problem-it gets like concrete and makes everything difficult-use a propane torch to heat the chains-carefully!

 

[D6B_dude]

Tried to start up my D6B today. Started great, but was frozen to the ground. The tractor have been standing still for a year, and the last month the temperature has been way below freezing. I did derail a track trying to get it lose.

 

[Balzomedic]

D6B dude,
Is that your D6B pictured in your avatar?

 

[D6B_dude]

Yes, it's a picture taken before I bought it.