Engine Idle Time

[JointVenture]

Hello there folks ...

Been back at building the 1400' drive for a few days now, and have a question about letting diesel engines idle. This is a one man operation, so I load the truck, leave the backhoe running, drive the truck up through old woods roads, dump the load, then back. It's about a half hour cycle ... two loads per hour. Ten minutes to load the truck, twenty minutes for the round trip with the truck. So for every hour, the backhoe works for twenty minutes, the truck for forty minutes. I'm in Connecticut, so it's getting cold ... ~30°f this morning, warming up to about 50 this afternoon.

My question is this ... would you shut down the backhoe while the truck is working? I've been leaving them both running all day, but reality is diesel fuel is $3.00+ a gallon these days. With a CAT 3208 in the Ford, and a D-358 in the IHC backhoe, I'm going through some fuel, not excessive ... just thinking some could be saved if one or both is shut down while idling :beatsme
I'm more concerned with "wear and tear" on the engines than saving fuel, so perhaps I should leave them both running.

What say you?

Thanks,

JV

 

[Willis Bushogin]

engine idle

Hello there folks ...

Been back at building the 1400' drive for a few days now, and have a question about letting diesel engines idle. This is a one man operation, so I load the truck, leave the backhoe running, drive the truck up through old woods roads, dump the load, then back. It's about a half hour cycle ... two loads per hour. Ten minutes to load the truck, twenty minutes for the round trip with the truck. So for every hour, the backhoe works for twenty minutes, the truck for forty minutes. I'm in Connecticut, so it's getting cold ... ~30°f this morning, warming up to about 50 this afternoon.

My question is this ... would you shut down the backhoe while the truck is working? I've been leaving them both running all day, but reality is diesel fuel is $3.00+ a gallon these days. With a CAT 3208 in the Ford, and a D-358 in the IHC backhoe, I'm going through some fuel, not excessive ... just thinking some could be saved if one or both is shut down while idling :beatsme
I'm more concerned with "wear and tear" on the engines than saving fuel, so perhaps I should leave them both running.

What say you?

Thanks,

JV

My problem with leaving a engine running and unattended, is what if
1. it runs hot (blows a water line)
2. blows a oil line and ruins the engine
3. blows a hydraulic line and ruins the pump
4. etc

If Im working around the machine (close by) I will leave it running, I think its easier on the engine, than starting and stopping, plus the engine is warmed up and ready to load the next load.
As cold as it might be, might be better to cut the backhoe off, when leaving it
Just my 2 cents worth

 

[bill onthehill]

I would shut the hoe down between loads. Just did the same sort of thing today and that is what I did.

 

[Red Bank]

Thanks for the pictures, I remember your gravel piles from one of your other threads, nice looking backhoe and truck. I agree with Willis and Bill, I know it seems like a lot of starting but I don't like to leave equipment running unattended either. But, of course, next week when you are replacing starters you will blaming us:drinkup Just kidding.

 

[geneb]

Just don't get distracted and for get to cut it off! My uncle did this and left our dump truck running for two days. I love holding that over his head.

 

[carogator]

we all agree. turn them off when unattended. backhoe for sure.

 

[JointVenture]

Thanks for the advice guys :cool2

Hadn't really thought through the possibility of some sort of failure Willis ... very good point! Newest machine there is 30 years old! Was actually more concerned with theft, which will never happen ... this place is way out in the woods!

I'll be shutting her down from this point forward.

:usa

JV

 

[Vantage_TeS]

Fuel wise, I wouldn't worry about it. They use very very little idling (for example a 18.5L turbo diesel on a hoe in the 850/385 - 90 ton class runs around 80-90L an hour under load vs 5-8L an hour idle). Considering you have to let it warm up/cool down so you have proper lubrication to the turbo etc if you can leave it running you should do so cost/time wise.

However failure wise it's nice to keep an eye on things and be close by if anything happened. Then again I have yet to see ANY piece of machinery break down let alone have a catastrophic failure while it was simply sitting there idling. (We have an average of 20 pieces of equipment on any given job site and they idle 30 min every morning assuming they are working, 30 min at lunch, 15 min twice a day for coffee. Also sometimes a piece is started in the morning for a mechanic and idles aaaaaaalllllll day no issue).

If your machine is a giant heap and leaks this and that and everything is loose, ok sure it MAY manage to blow itself up but 99.9% of the time it will always be under load not sitting there idling.

But hey, it's your stuff, do what you're comfortable with.

 

[cummins05]

I also leave machines idle never had a failure yet but some day i may get my tune changed

 

[wcglover]

If your pressure/temperture shutdowns are working I wouldnt worry about a failure. I dont know how cold it gets there but diesel engines dont like to run when cold and if you only run it for 20 mins and then shut it down for 40 mins it will never get to operating temp. Loading a cold engine will cause more damge then letting it idle. Also if it is colder then -10*c (whatever that is in *F) then you need to idle it at a higher RPM (around 1000). Like Vantage TeS said an idling machine will use very little fuel but every dollar counts, especially these days. If it is cold out I would idle it, if it is warm out I would shut it down.

Nice equipment by the way, it looks like it is well taken care of. What year and what engine/trans in the truck? How many hours on the backhoe?

 

[Drifter]

Dont leave it idle rev it up to 1200 or so rpm.

 

[RonG]

I would leave it running.The flip side for me is sitting there for three minutes waiting for the cooldown before shutting it off and that can add up over the course of a day and I do that without fail,especially if it is turbocharged.
I don't ever recall an engine failing while idling in all of my years in the business.It could happen however but I can't recall ever hearing about one.
The Detroits can really scare you because their oil pressure drops to nearly zero when hot idling and if you are not familiar with them it can be unnerving to say the least.
I was going to stop by and give you a hand someday but it wouldn't really be much help since you can only do one thing at a time anyway.Ron G

 

[JointVenture]

Thanks for all your thoughts on this, I really appreciate it
So it would seem that when it's cold (≤ freezing), the general consensus is to leave it running at a high idle ... low idle when warmer. To keep the engine at proper running temps is the most important thing when it comes to longevity.

wcglover - I believe it's a '78, an old town truck used for plowing mostly. It may have been a tractor at one time ... there's two fish plates on the frame indicating it was either shortened on lengthened :beatsme It has a CAT 3208 engine with a 5 speed trany (no two speed rear end) ... a real tree climber, which is great for what I need it for. The old woods roads I'm traveling over are real bumpy and narrow, with many sharp turns ... so the short chassis helps in that regard. Picked it up for $2K this past summer
Don't have any idea how many hours are on the backhoe .. the meter stopped at about 3300. It's a good strong machine, has a few minor cylinder leaks, though the front bucket "leveling system" (don't really know what it's called) doesn't work, so I've dumped a few good size rocks onto the engine cover Have the repair manual now and will look into fixin that this winter. Also the entire electrical system is shot ... no lights, wipers, heater, or even the tachometer! Apparently the alternator was replaced at one time with the wrong one, without a connection for the tach. Picked it up in September for $7K Thanks for askin!

RonG - Thanks for the offer ... stop by anytime if you'd like, I'll PM the location to ya.

:usa

JV