Gland removal - 580E

[jimg]

I've got a 580 Super E that the bucket is acting weak after I abused it with some very cantilevered loads (bridge girder placement). I'm trying to rebuild the bucket cylinders, and the left one was a piece of cake. I only needed a pipe wrench to remove the gland. The right cylinder has been a tough one. After failing with the pipe wrench, I bought a 3/4 drive gland wrench, and after trying my impact gun and a two foot cheater bar, I called the nearest shop, and his suggestion was to beat on the end of the tube over the threads. I tried that with no improvement. Once the paint was torn up, I went with a propane torch, then tried a six foot cheater bar, which resulted in a sheared pin on my gland wrench.

Although the nearest shop (about 100 miles) offered to take a crack at it, they said they occasionally end up cutting the tube to rescue the piston and replacing the gland and tube.

I don't even know if there's anything really wrong with the cylinder, as the left one looked to be in pretty good shape. My bucket worked fine, but when I was using it as an anchor for backhoe work, it would roll after a few minutes. Maybe it's the spool or pressure relief?

Anyone have a next suggestion?

 

[nova481]

I came across this while searching for the same problem

https://www.heavyequipmentforums.com/showthread.php?11396-Hoist-piston-end-cap-removal-question

 

[willie59]

Yep nova481, works most every time I've tried it, only be a few very very stubborn cylinders that it didn't work.

 

[shopguy]

Sounds like the locking screw is still in with the head broken off so you dont see it ,just a thought

 

[rickw]

Sounds like the locking screw is still in with the head broken off so you dont see it ,just a thought

Thats what it sounds like to me. The one we have rebuilt the gland unscrewed with a pair of large channel-locks after loosening the set screw.. Its not a left handed thread is it?

 

[alrman]

Its not a left handed thread is it?

Nah, they're all RH thread - be sure the lockscrew is out & just give it the ATCO treatment - it works!

 

[jimg]

I tried random peening earlier, but I'll try the methodical approach today. I was sitting in the local bar last night with my neighbor who operated this stuff for 40 years, and he suggested the same method. He also thought the fact that the piston moved easily despite holding against a blocked inlet sounded like this one may be the culprit for my problem.

 

[jimg]

Well, that didn't work. I did six lines of peening around the tube and sheared off two more pins of the gland wrench (with a 4 foot cheater). I'll try more in the morning, but I'm disappointed...

 

[willie59]

Did you verify that gland retainer screw is removed?

I really don't like using a torch to heat end of barrel unless I have no other options. I have had a few particularly nasty stuck glands, used a hot high pressure washer that made really good hot water, heated the end of cylinder and gland with the hot water. Several cycles of heating, peening, cooling, then heat again, was able to get them loose. Good luck.

 

[jimg]

Yes, I promise the setscrew is removed! Given the alternative of finding a used cylinder for $500 or so, or sawing into the thing to salvage the rod and piston (and buying aftermarket tube and gland for > $500), I guess I'll attack it with a cold chisel or maybe weld up a tool that can use all four pinholes at once. Maybe I'm not peening the thing hard enough, but as I swing harder, my accuracy drops, so I end up with a scattered pattern of dimples in the tube. I've soaked the thing in PBBlaster and banged on it from all directions with my 3 lb sledge. I guess the worst I can do is ruin it...

The left cylinder was so easy to do that I really set myself up for crushing disappointment!

 

[willie59]

Nothing to be disappointed about jimg, you know the old saying, s**t happens, you could have a gland that someone prior to you has worked on and messed up the threads, basically made it go back together, I've seen this before.

 

[jimg]

After bashing on the thing with everything I have, including my rosebud, I drove the 75 miles to the nearest shop, and told them to have at it. I couldn't watch the carnage due to insurance things, so I waited in the lobby like an expectant father, listening to everyone complain about the constant pounding coming out of the shop. After 45 minutes, the shop went quiet, and the service manager came out to announce a successful delivery! I've already cleaned up the corrosion and installed the seal kit, and the cylinder is sitting ready to return to the machine in the morning. It was well worth the $45 in shop labor to avoid a replacement. I guess I have to go buy some bigger tools!

 

[willie59]

Well, it's good to hear you were able to repair it. That's a tough one you had there.

 

[bowen]

:bash
I have heard stories about some using a 10 foot long cheater with a large pipe wrench and 2 men bending the cheater to get some loose.
I have not tried it yet but I wonder if one man with a pipe wrench + another man using the gland wrench with a bar would work.
If you could get both on the end at the same time it seems this might give you twice the power. ?

I work alone normally so I have been letting another fellow do mine, but he says the nut inside the cylinder can be harder to get loose than the outside gland.
He says heat is always required to loosen that bolt with red locktite on the threads.
And he says to put the red locktite back on there so it does not come apart on the inside.ops

 

[jimg]

The gland on a 580E era cylinder presents only about 3/16" of area for the wrench to grab. The gland wrench is only about 1/8" off the gland surface, so the pipe wrench would have to be terribly narrow. I know from personal experience that a six foot cheater will shear the gland wrench pins. I thought about welding up a special gland wrench using all four pin holes and providing attachment of two cheaters, but when I found a used cylinder for $270, I decided that letting the shop try was the easiest, with disaster not being that terrible. I also work alone, and I'm guessing a second person to apply hammer blows might have done the trick.

 

[bowen]

$270 would have been way cheaper than a new cylinder from Case.
You can often look at this end of a cylinder and tell if it's been rebuilt by the teeth marks of a large pipe wrench.
The local shop likes to rebuild these right on the machine. If you take it off you will need a pretty large bench setup just to hold the other end.

Case cylinder rebuild kits seem to be real cheap to me at $30-$50 each. I consider this cheap considering what other parts cost from them.
Some shops rebuild them for $60-$100 labor which is also reasonable considering the problem you had.
Still when you have 6 or 8 of these that need new seal kits, it runs up close to $1000.
I have my boom cylinders done, but still like the 6 others.