help - D9R -excessive oil consumption

[mrrs19]

Hello all

My friend working in a new D9R with S/N WDM
The problem now excessive oil consumption about 15-20 liters per 250 hours working
The performance of this machine is very good
Type of the oil is CH4
Service hour meter is 1900 hr
Can anyone help us to know the root causes like this problem
Thanks in advance

 

[GaryHoff]

Is your engine burning the oil, (smoke color will have a blue hint to it) or is your engine blowing it out the exhaust ( exhaust may be wet with oil ) If blowing out the exhaust, check the turbo (turbo should be dry if oil found seals leaking). The turbo could also be leaking to the intake side and burning oil that way. If your engine is burning oil, are you overworking the unit? Too much load will burn oil. Are you sure you dont have any oil leaks on engine (check your front engine seal, rear engine seal, oil cooler, filter, ect.) What grade of oil are you using, 15w40 or 0w40? Too light of an oil can burn too. If everything else is ok do a compression test. A failed compression test would indicate scored rings/liners.

 

[willd8r]

Hi Had experience with a 3406 using oil put a hot themostat in, problem soved

 

[mrrs19]

Hi
Thank you for great information
We inspected the engine carefully , no leaks and the exhaust normal
The oil grade 15W40 ambient temperature is 44 c
But if I do the compression test and found the engine out of the range that means the ring or liner defect
I ask the reasons of defected the ring or liner early about 1900hr
thanks in advance

 

[SterlingR]

You are loosing 4 to 5 gallons in 250 hours. I would think it should be pretty obvious. Does the transmission oil look clean? I would check turbo seals. How long has it done this?

 

[GaryHoff]

The reason for a failed compression test at such early hours would be because of a air intake leak (non- filtered air is getting to the engine). This can be causes by a hole in the air filters or loose hose clamps on the air intake. The dust acts like sandpaper on your engine, scoring your liners, alowing oil in the combustion chamber. The other possibility could be the engine has been overheated (also causing internal damage) Did you check your turbo carefully??? was both the intake and exhaust side of the turbo dry??? If it is wet with oil, replace. (a leaking turbo can lead to further engine damage)

 

[willie59]

mrrs19, I noticed your in Egypt. Are you operating the machine in dusty or sandy areas. If so, you have to keep a constant eye on the air filters, as in check once or even twice daily. I'd even install a good quality pre-cleaner on the air pipe on top of the hood. If you allow any fine dust or sand particles past the air cleaners, you will destroy your cylinders quicky. I know this doesn't help with your oil consumption question, but it may be the root cause of your oil consumption.

 

[mrrs19]

Hi all
Really I thank you all for your help
DRESSTA1 and GaryHoff
I will check the transmission oil and turbo (lines + intake side +exhaust side)
ATCOEQUIP
Yes the machine operation in very dust and sandy areas
Your opinion excellent about putting pre- cleaner on the top of the hood also checking the air filter twice daily it very good idea
I with your opinion about the dust and sandy area are the root cause also it help me after repair the engine to avoid repeat this problem
I will inform you by the new after take the decision
Thank you all again for your help

 

[willie59]

Keep us updated with what you find mrrs19. Follow the advice of DRESSTA1 and GaryHoff, check your turbo for leakage, check you intake piping and rubber elbows. It think it's very likely dust and sand is your killer. You have to keep it out of your engine. Like GaryHoff said, it's like sandpaper in an engine. I don't know what's available in your area, but a pre-cleaner I've had good results with is the Turbo brand pre-cleaner. It will reduce the amount of dust/sand that goes into your air cleaner, except maybe during a sandstorm, the only piece of heavy equipment designed to work in a sandstorm would be a camel. Here's you a link to the Turbo precleaner.


http://www.turboprecleaner.com/default.html

 

[mrrs19]

Hi all
Please I need your opinion about the filter(primary filter) statues
The working hours for this filter after cleaning is 80HR
The air indicator not red
What about the pre cleaner is it good or not
Thank in advance

 

[SterlingR]

I would replace you precleaner with a turbo two type precleaner. The main thing that concerns me about the filter, it does not appear to have a very good seal. If you look at the picture of the filter standing up, if that in fact is the sealing portion of the filter. There should be a clean ring around the end to represent it is sealing tight. It may just be the picture but if you look inside the filter around the 6 oclock position it looks like dirt building up inside. As far as the outside of the filter giving your conditions I would say it looks fine. I have seen applications where you change the air filter every couple hours.

I just noticed the link ATCOEQUIP put in his response, but that is the precleaner system you need.

 

[RHIT02]

Look at adding the 330-1914 precleaner arrangement. It is par to of the dessert arrangement for your type of application (260-7629)

 

[willie59]

Yeah man, the pre-cleaner that's on the machine now might work in the forests of the Pacific Northwest, but it's certain engine destruction where you are mrrs19. And the air filter indicator isn't going to be that accurate for you as well. The indicator measure how much restriction the filter has from contamination. With heavy particles, that's not that big a concern. With the fine dust you see on your filter, that would be bad if you allowed the filter to get filled with that fine dust. It's best to keep as much of that dust out of the filter as is possible to do.

 

[Richardjw~]

I haven't had anything to do with Cats in desert conditions, but have had a LOT to do with Ag. machines in dry, dusty areas of the world.

As has been noted the issue would appear to be the poor sealing of the air-filter, particularly the photo of the filter stood up - dust seems to be covering the sealing area.
Look in the filter canister where the primary filter seals to see if there appears to be a ull 360 degree ring, or maybe a portion where it isn't sealing. put a lit light-bulb inside the filter and inspect the outer side to see if light shines out through indicating any porousity, pay special attention to the ends where the paper element 'should' be bonded to the end caps.

If it has dusted the engine whip off the air hoses to the turbo and see if it has 'blasted' or dusted the turbine blades.

Although fitting the TURBO pre-cleaner is a useful addition it is not really solving the real issue which *appears* to be poor sealing in the air intake


will be interested to hear what you find

 

[PAcattech]

Hey guys theres nothing wrong with the sealing area of the air filter that i see That is a cat radial seal air filter They do not seal on the end like conventional air filters they seal on the inside diameter of the opening

 

[Richardjw~]

Hey guys theres nothing wrong with the sealing area of the air filter that i see That is a cat radial seal air filter They do not seal on the end like conventional air filters they seal on the inside diameter of the opening

ahhhh, yes.....I can see that now

 

[mrrs19]

Hi
I made the blow by test and crank case pressure test
The blow by was 340 Liter /M at stall speed
The crank case pressure was 0.8 (under 1 no wear happened)
Let us discus the test result
I see from the above result that engine not need to overhaul
Then we will back again to know the reason of the oil consumption

 

[JDOFMEMI]

Back to the air filter issue, we have seen the outer filter, but even in the event it passes some small amount of dust, it should still be kept out of the engine by the inner filter. The inner is the safety filter. If the inside of it is clean, chances are pretty good you have not gotten dust in the engine.
The test results seem to back that up. I would look for other places the oil may have gone. Is there any evidence of engine oil getting into the transmission or hydrailic system?

 

[willie59]

Back to the air filter issue, we have seen the outer filter, but even in the event it passes some small amount of dust, it should still be kept out of the engine by the inner filter. The inner is the safety filter. If the inside of it is clean, chances are pretty good you have not gotten dust in the engine.
The test results seem to back that up. I would look for other places the oil may have gone. Is there any evidence of engine oil getting into the transmission or hydrailic system?

All good points. Yes, there is an inner (safety) air filter. But consider it's there for (safety) purposes in case of primary filter failure. The only thing I wanted to point out is that if mrrs19 is working in extreme sandy/dusty conditions in Egypt that it's possible very fine micron particles can go through the air filters and that constant maintenance is advisable. Beyond that, I know nothing about a D-9 and it's engine. So, what's causing oil consumption. I can see where the usual suspects have been mentioned. Turbo is always a suspect. JDOFMEMI mentions oil getting into tranny, does the D-9 use a wet sump convertor housing? What about worn exhaust valve guides/seals? Lastly, even though the compression rings on the piston are still good enough to have good compression and minimal blow-by, is it possible to have bad oil rings? I have no clue, just a thought.

 

[flashpuppy]

It's time for Oil Sample Analysis. Engine, Trans, Hyd and Antifreeze. This will tell you right off if it's going somewhere else in the machine.