How do You Equip Your Trucks/Shop as far as Purchasing Tools and Manuals

[Scout_1969]

A little background:
I am an individual and work on my own equipment as some of you may have gathered from my posts. I try to fix what I can myself and enjoy solving problems as I know a lot of people do. I don't always like the delays or decision making process though.

The cost of tools and manuals for me adds up but I just work on a few pieces and don't do any specialty work, in my opinion. I have considered buying a tool or manual and thought it was too expensive only to realize that I need it and should have bought it a long time ago.

I certainly can appreciate the costs and hours spent for you professional mechanics to be prepared and ready to go. Especially some of you guys that work on various makes and models. Not to mention the decision making that's involved in the entire process. :notworthy

Question:

So like the title says, How do You Equip Your Trucks/Shop as far as Purchasing Tools and Manuals?

I guess the independent mechanic bears 100% of his cost but what about you guys that work for someone else?

Does the company buy some and you buy some?

How much of an investment is there?

 

[Greg]

Around here the vast majority of the work on all the equipment gets done by me. Get into the big jobs where deep into an engine, transmission or other power train I have help from a local mechanic who has lots of experience.

Have both tech manual and parts book for all machines here. Tech manuals can get expensive but in my experience are well worth the cost.

As far as tools and shop equipment goes I have a small fortune invested in addition to the building.

When I look at the money saved by not sending equipment to a shop for work on it the shop has paid for itself many times over. The total investment in tools and shop equipment usually pays for itself every year.

Us smaller guys can't afford to send everything out for everything that must be done. Big things get planned for the winter and a good shop is a necessity for that.

 

[equip guy]

This is a good question you ask. From my perspective I have done a fair amount of research on what has been purchased. Yes there are some tools and reference materials that get seldome use and a good amount of funds were spent, but wether you work on your own stuff or are a professional mechanic who does it for a living things like service manuals and specialty tools are a must. Some scopes of work can be done with out a manual or with general tools, but one can remember head torque sequences or every clearance on each piece you work on even if YOU own it. There are sites out there with used service manuals for much less than the OEM price and the same goes for certain specialty tools. Although I pretty much have a service and parts manual for every piece I maintain, I have been switching to CD's. They are 1/2 the cost and can print out just the pages I want and it doesn't matter if I trash up the paper work, I can print up new ones. I try to set a budget on tools each year unless a certain break down occurs and the tool is needed. Problem with that in some cases some dealer service tools like JD are made in batches and are not always ready available which holds up the job, so I try to buy in advance knowing what type of work I will be tackling and will have for future work. It is expensive. Its all supply and demand. Make sure you invest in good quality hand tools that have a warranty, and service. I won't get into brands. To answer your other qustion as investments, my shop buys the big stuff like jacks, lifts, computer diagnostic equipment, tire tools and alike. Probably 200 thousand in shop hard goods and I have approx 60 thousand in my own tools. This is over 25 years though. It adds up quick. I might be under on the shop equipment costs though. I haven't added shop overhead, consumables, services like parts cleaner, waste stream removal, lift certifications, utilities, insurance, comp, payroll, the building, support staff and vehicles, and more, I probably have 7-8 thousand in tech/parts info and software. and it grows each year. Good luck on your quest.

 

[curb guy]

Scout, I buy a TON of tools/manuals on e-bay.Saved thousands of dollars over the years. As long as you know exactly what you're looking for and, know what retail is ,you can get get some great deals. just my opinion......

 

[grandpa]

Scout, I work on my own equipment too. When I make the deal for a new or used piece of equipment , part of the deal is parts and service manuels. Equipment dealers are so eager to 'MAKE THE DEAL" getting this books is an ez task,, make sure its in writing on the order, cause at times when the salesman finds out the price of said books, it usually ends up coming out of his pocket....lol.... Gramps

 

[Randy88]

Wrench on my own equipment, own all my own tools, general, speciality, you name it I've either got it or have access to it, also weld, fabricate, lathes, miling machines, plasma cutter, torches, everything a full shop would have I'll usually end up with eventually so I can do what needs to be done, parts and service manuals on most every piece of equipment I own, working on a heated shop right now, its a work in progress as funds and time allows, otherwise its a tin machine shed or under the stars. I do it all, no matter what it is, if its mine and needs repair until I win the lottery I'm gonna die with a wrench in my hand or until I get rid of the last piece of equipment, whichever comes first.

As for costs, I shop around, I'm not big into the name brand stuff like snap on, mac, matco any of the high end stuff, its more like whatever gets the job done cheap. As far as am I ever done buying tools, the answer is no, and never will be done either, its just how it works out I guess, if you need it you go buy it. I shop around some on ebay and some other places for used stuff as much as possible, but I also know what new costs as well, so I don't pay too much on anything I buy used, as for manuals I've never found that good of a deal on used ones, I like paper to look at with pictures, I'm not into the cd's or things for computers, I'd rather dig out a actual shop manual and look at those, guess I'm old fashioned.

I've also got a fully stocked service truck, with welder/generator, fuel, lube and fully stocked with tools, parts and whatever else I need to survive and service stuff in the field. I've often wondered just how many dollars I've got tied up in tools and parts everything to do what I do, but then I'm told just how much the local shops get per hour, that means I should have plenty of money left over at the end of the year for all the money I saved by doing it myself, but I just end up buying more stuff is all, its a never ending cycle it seems.

 

[Scout_1969]

Thanks for the replies gentlemen.

Have both tech manual and parts book for all machines here. Tech manuals can get expensive but in my experience are well worth the cost.

.....When I look at the money saved by not sending equipment to a shop for work on it the shop has paid for itself many times over.

.....Big things get planned for the winter and a good shop is a necessity for that.

I learned my lesson on manuals and while I don't operate a business, I like the savings of working on my own equipment. My next big project is going to be a garage, for our car and pickup but I am planning a tall bay for fit the backhoe or dump truck in.

...but wether you work on your own stuff or are a professional mechanic who does it for a living things like service manuals and specialty tools are a must.

.....There are sites out there with used service manuals for much less than the OEM price and the same goes for certain specialty tools. I have been switching to CD's. They are 1/2 the cost and can print out just the pages I want and it doesn't matter if I trash up the paper work, I can print up new ones.

I am finding out about the specialty tools/manuals too (a lot are 'specialty' for me as I am just starting to work on more complex problems) and that's part of my decision making problems. I may start a tool budget to be more proactive.

I just purchased the download version of the JD tech manual,had it printed on quality paper and still saved over buying the OEM paper version. Sometimes I like the paper but I do sometimes printout the sections I am concerned with.

Scout, I buy a TON of tools/manuals on e-bay.Saved thousands of dollars over the years. As long as you know exactly what you're looking for and, know what retail is ,you can get get some great deals. just my opinion......

I found a manual for my dump truck and engine on ebay and saved money, I just couldn't find a JD tech manual and finally had to get the download

....When I make the deal for a new or used piece of equipment , part of the deal is parts and service manuels

My purchases haven't been from dealers yet but I will keep that in mind. I always ask about the manuals and it sure 'sweetens' the deal.

 

[Randy88]

Keep good communication going with local repair shops, I've borrowed speciality tools and also photocopied sections out of their repair manuals before as well as asking questions to the professionals and getting tips and tricks they've learned over the years as to how to do short cuts and sometimes an easier way than the manuals say to go about it. Their also a fountain of knowledge about diagnosing problems I can't quite figure out. If your descent to them, the old timers will be pretty helpfull to you in return, that and as one told me if I help you out by telling you how to do it, then maybe I won't have to fix your machine and can work on someone else's instead ........................... or the harder the repair the more information they will usually give me so they don't have to do it, found that very true over the years.

Parts guys will also provide me sometimes with service manuals to look at and photocopy, I've even borrowed shop manuals a few times over the years if they were high priced and I didn't have the money to buy one. Also keep a friendly communication going with other owners of like kind equipment, join some organizations that are into the same types of things as you are, others around you have certain tools and manuals they will sometimes loan you to help a new guy out and you can return the favor by lending them some information they need, works both directions, this is also an excellent way to also gain insight and knowledge on how to do repairs and diagianosis of problems, yours isn't the only machine to ever break down, others have had the same things as you go wrong and you'd be surprised as how others have fixed or found the problems before you. Its a give and take thing, always give back somehow to those that gave you something, like information or loaned you a manual or speciality tool, give a gift card or pay for their dinner or something like that, it keeps them happy and they know you appreciated it, buy some parts locally, do as they say whatever it takes sometimes to get the job done. I know there are a lot of shops that have a "we don't lend tools or manuals policy" but at the same time I can tell you I"ve done just that, they even sometimes offer me the stuff if I need it, its called trust and always take good care of it, way better than you'd take of your own stuff and return it promptly and clean is a must as well.

Don't know how handy you are or what machines you have at your disposal, but for a lot of things I'll make them myself, say for example a main seal installer on an IH 466, I measured one at my local IH dealer and went home and turned it on the lathe, injector puller the same way. All they wanted in return was to see what I had done, the finished product, works great and now I have access to measure any speciality tool I want if its something I think I can build myself, it was somewhat of a conversation thing for quite a while, for that shop, they came up with a tool they didn't have but got the measurements for me and I built them that tool, now I can take home any serice manual I need or speciality tool that they have I can't duplicate myself, not to mention any mechanic there will gladly help me with any question I've got. One act of kindness has opened the door to many things on my behalf. I've even borrowed speciality tools from shops and taken them to a more advanced machine shop and they've made them for me at a fraction of the cost of buying a new one, thats also another great way to come up with some of the things you'll need.

As they say when your broke and don't have any money doesn't mean you can't come up with things to fix your own stuff and fill in the gap of the lack of funds, there are plenty of ways to work around not having any money, you just have to think a little bit and be a descent person and you'll be surprised as to how to work around the problem. It doesn't happen overnight it takes time to build up trust and a relationship with these people and always keep it in good standing, don't ever sleeve any repair shop or cheat them in any way, word gets around, if your short on funds and money is tight, talk to them before buying anything, be upfront and honest with them and work around it, if you need some time on monthly payments on parts or whatever, do the negotiating up front not afterwards, it'll keep you in good standing with them that will help you out later on down the road in ways you'll never imagine today.

 

[Scout_1969]

...until I win the lottery I'm gonna die with a wrench in my hand or until I get rid of the last piece of equipment, whichever comes first.

...am I ever done buying tools, the answer is no, and never will be done either...

...I like paper to look at with pictures...

..plenty of money left over at the end of the year for all the money I saved by doing it myself, but I just end up buying more stuff is all, its a never ending cycle it seems.

The first sentence would make a good signature. The other three pretty much sum up my thoughts as well.

Keep good communication going with local repair shops...
...asking questions to the professionals and getting tips and tricks they've learned over the years as to how to do short cuts...

...as one told me if I help you out by telling you how to do it, then maybe I won't have to fix your machine............................ or the harder the repair the more information they will usually give me so they don't have to do it....

Also keep a friendly communication going with other owners of like kind equipment, join some organizations that are into the same types of things as you are...

Its a give and take thing, always give back somehow to those that gave you something.....

...buy some parts locally, do as they say whatever it takes sometimes to get the job done.

..they even sometimes offer me the stuff if I need it, its called trust and always take good care of it, way better than you'd take of your own stuff and return it promptly and clean is a must as well.

Don't know how handy you are or what machines you have at your disposal, but for a lot of things I'll make them myself..

All they wanted in return was to see what I had done... any mechanic there will gladly help me with any question I've got.

It doesn't happen overnight it takes time to build up trust and a relationship with these people and always keep it in good standing...

..talk to them before buying anything, be upfront and honest with them and work around it... whatever, do the negotiating up front not afterwards, it'll keep you in good standing with them that will help you out later on down the road in ways you'll never imagine today.

I am just starting on building relationships with mechanic, parts stores and other equipment owners.

I try to give them a little feedback especially after I read here on HEF, something like 'most mechanics just want to know how their advice turned out' and that would be true in here on HEF or otherwise. I guess it's pretty simple and universal for all people that help someone.

I am on the bottom of the 'food chain' as far as being handy, but I keep venturing a little further all the time.

Good advice about negotiating, we all like to save a buck but not at the expense of a future need.

 

[Richardjw~]

out of interest what do you fellas prefer, paper manuals or thoses on a CD?

Reason I ask is that trends now seem to be towards electronic versions and on-line, dealers (Ag) seem to want to save costs on buying these, moreover the manuals seem to get thicker all the time, to my mind a book/paper version is more likely to get read than something on a laptop, laptops are ok for diagnostics but totally impractical for tracing wiring diagrams etc. esp. with a dying battery, oily hands, dust, bright sunlight and so forth.....what would you rather work from?

 

[Randy88]

Richard, in my opinion, and its only my opinon, I want a paper manual, reasons being, first off, I'm in the weather and don't want my laptop to freeze in the truck or get damp, wet, greasy, oily, or left out in the shop overnight or in the service truck or whatever, a manual can sit on the shelf for decades if not used and when I need it it's there or left on my service truck for months under the seat and nothing can really happen to it, a cd or laptop isn't so flexable, not to mention always having to have it charged. I'll write in the manuals for part numbers that have been updated, phone numbers of places that have parts, make changes to the manuals as mechanics or I learn things new. Apparently I'm not as 'techy' as most are and don't know how to do all the updates, changes, add things onto the cd's without totally destroying them and above all keep them from getting scratched or damaged.

I take the manuals everywhere, under the machine thats being worked on to compare things in pictures and also to reread a dozen times to try to figure out what the manuals tell me in relationship to the machine. I'll photocopy sections out while others are working on something on the same machine but in a different section of the manual where we both need the manual at the same time, I"ve only got one laptop. And best of all when my laptops in for repairs all my manuals are still with me when I need them, they never go on for repairs, or go down or freeze up or act up or have dead batteries and are not oil, grease, temperature sensative or about a dozen other things, and once wet manuals dry out over time, laptops require some technical assistance to help that along and I don't know how to do that to laptops. But ask my son the same question and he'll give you the exact opposite answer I just did because he loves his laptop and the amount of information he can store on it in such a small compact size, so as they say whatever trips your trigger.

 

[Dualie]

when i buy something to run long term i consider it part of the purchase to pick up the service manual. I also keep filters and wear parts in stock for most of my machines. specialty tools i buy on an as needed basis.

if you work on your own stuff enough all of this stuff pays for itself in the long run.

 

[Mr. Butcher.]

The company that I work for sometimes has (shall we call them brain farts) for want of a better word! They recently totally refuse to buy any workshop manuals for machines, it gets frustrating when 10 chaps have to go through 1 awkward Forman for parts and technical specs. Though any tools broken on the job will be replaced if manufactures warranty doesn’t cover them, also the essential and bigger kit e.g. Air guns and sockets, track presses/gear, chains/slings, drills, grinders, welders, electrical gear, water proves and safety gear etc, etc, all get bought for the shop and fitters to use, that does make things easier. Though where ever you go some folks fair better and some worse.

 

[Responder]

As Randy88 said, "Keep good communication going with local repair shops"

Can't stress that enough! Sometimes it is amazing how far a box of donuts or muffins will go in keeping up with the Public Relations! Try and drop them off at a time when you DON'T need something. Works well.

You definately need the manuals. We just purchased a used HDD and ordered a parts manual for it. Looking for a service manual for it now as well. In my opinion, these are well worth the money!

 

[crewchief888]

FWIW
i've been employed by several heavy eq dealerships over the past 25+ years.
tools are the mechanics responsibility up to 1 1/2" 1/2" dr air, electric, and cordless
dealers also provided wrenches, sockets over 1 1/2" 3/4" & 1" dr impacts.
welders, torches, A/C equipment, flow meters, gauges and any OEM required special tools.

safety gear all depended on the dealership, i've always bought my own glasses, gloves, welding gear

i guess i'm old school, but i prefer my printed manuals, even tho i have them all loaded on computer.

over the years i've probably spent way too much on tools
i'd really hate to have to replace them all now, i'm probably looking at $100K

all of my "working" tools came brand new off one of the big 3 tool trucks.
same with all my machinists tools i bought when i started my apprenticeship
garage toolboxes are packed with a little bit of everything, from SO to HF, some new, some used, some used vintage.

some dealers dont hand out free advise, so dont get offended if they wont, all depends on the dealer.
most of all, dont be a smartass to the guy you're talking to, treat him/her like you would like to be treated.
keep your conversation short, and to the point, and always say thank you.

this might sound arrogant, and may offend someone but, the mechanic you're talking to isnt making money standing there talking, he makes money for his dealer pulling wrenches when someone is paying the shop's labor rate.