land clearing techniques

[fiat41b]

whats the going price for clearing and grubbing trees these days and having to burn them with an air curtain can anyone give me suggestions

 

[hardtail]

Those trees look like your 8 will walk through, the 41 won't even grunt.......

I don't know about this air curtain stuff :beatsme but clearing up here a few years ago was 200/acre with a D8 and rotovator, they made 2 passes crossways and everything below was chopped up, brush piled and burned.

Of course that was prior to our latest oil boom and prices could be 3-400 and acre now??

 

[special tool]

Those trees look like your 8 will walk through, the 41 won't even grunt.......

I don't know about this air curtain stuff :beatsme but clearing up here a few years ago was 200/acre with a D8 and rotovator, they made 2 passes crossways and everything below was chopped up, brush piled and burned.

Of course that was prior to our latest oil boom and prices could be 3-400 and acre now??

I agree - maybe you are being a little conservative based on those pictures?
Surely a 41 won't even roll any coal pushing over those sticks?

I understand the time issue well, but it looks like you and the equipment you outlined are the right man for that job.
Noone will question the judgement, no way.

 

[Billy X]

From what I can see in those photos it looks like your 8 would handle those trees no problems.Chaining would be a good option,however there are a few things to consider, first of all have you ever done any or know someone that has?The last thing you need is to try and learn how to pull timber with 2 operators that have never chained in there life.Having a set time for the job I would be sticking to what you know.As I have seen alot of track plates torn off,track chains busted in half and every now and then you would here about the odd final drive housing being busted from wrapping the chain up and over it.
My 10 cents worth. Set your 8 up with a timber rake of some sort,and let your 41 go ahead and knock the timber down laying it all one way and rake with the 8 across the timber.
However if you are hell bent on trying some chaining I would for tractors that size be getting at least 300 to 400 feet of 3 to 3/1/2 inch chain,as you have no hills to contend with the heavier the chain the better as it will do alot better job on the small trees.Our chain that sits between a D7H and D7G most of the time is 350 feet long,about 200 feet is 2/1/2 inch and we have about 75 feet each end that is just under 2 inch high tensile,this way the heavy chain is in the middle where you need it.We contend with alot of hills so you have to find a happy medium.

 

[Construct'O]

With the time factor and possible bad weather i'd figure at least $1000 dollars an acre.

I would just clear the trees and forget the chain thing.Get the rake for sure since it will be a lot faster cleaning up things.Plus less dirt in the pile to contend with when you try to burn.

Some times bigger isn't always better,especially if you have to contend with muddy conditions.The bigger they are the deeper they sink!!!!!!!

So will you be digging a pit to burn in or are you going to try burning on top of the ground?Will you also be trying to burn as your clearing?

Cleared thirty acres with trees about the size of the smaller trees (lots of hedge)and brush with two dozers.D6H and R took about two weeks.About 5 acres of stumps that they cut even with the ground.Took longer to find and cleanup then to take them out.

It was going to be famred ,so no shearing or breaking off here.Everything had to be grubbed out and pushed a long ways to ditch or non farm area.Did the double team thing with both dozers side by side taking to bush piles.

At least we didn't have to burn anything luckly. By the way are they going to try and farm this or just clear.Anything sheared off will grow back,so if not farmed it will need to be mowed and sprayed later down the road if they plan on keeping it clean.Good luck!:usa

 

[fiat41b]

clearing

Hello again just thought i would let everyone know that this is a union project
and an operator cost me 60.00 per hr by the time i include all benifits and workers comp ins.
Addendum came out today and they still want the trees down in 30 days and the have to be completely burned or gone in 60 days. all roots removed 18" below surface that are 3" in diameter and all roots larger than 1/2" to a depth 6"
There are bigger trees out there the pictures are what i could get from the road but i would say the majority or average looks like the pictures. I dont know anyone around here that clears and burns with a air curtain for 1000.00
per acre if it goes that cheap they can have it that would be only 50,000 for 50 acres and i dont think i can run air curtains and excavators feeding them for that if im winning bidder i wont be digging a pit i would create an above ground pit where i can clean out the ash with a dozer or loader at ground level thanks for all your help and suggestions.

 

[Construct'O]

I was talking just the clearing,burning is your guess????? and yeah my operator wasn't getting $60 dollars an hour :drinkup and i was running one machine ,so as usual i was probably working for nothingointhead

Make sure you get all those roots now!!!!!!!! Again good luck:usa

 

[fiat41b]

clearing

Thats ok Constructo i work cheap by myself all the time thats how we make money not paying ourselves enough. 1000.00 per acre sounds good for farm work our maybe when you dont have anyone holding you to a time frame.I have mostly cleared by the hour nothing bigger than 10 to 15 acres lately have had other jobs in the past with larger acres but they had dirt work included i get 150 per hr. for my d6r lgp and 185 for my d8k never have got to work the 41 buy the hr. it would scare them away.

 

[Dozer575]

Are there any wet areas? If not that should be an easy job, gosh wish I could land something like that. The right guy on a properly equipped D8 should be able to do it in 12 days or so. With dozers I would have one rough clearing and the other cleaning and pushing piles. If you have to stack to burn then you need the excavator, a good dozer guy can do that too. 2 good dozers and guys should have it done in maybe 7 to 8 days. As long as all goes smooth no break downs, no other problems. As long as the ground is good and its just those trash trees. Both dozers with a good clearing head, good solid clearing blade with teeth like a beals. I did 30 acres in a week one time and that was with 2 to 3 foot fir stumps all logged first. Just a D8 with a splitter on rear and that includes cleaning the debris real good for a chipper.
A union guy probably won't work hard at it and with all your costs, time frame etc.
$3000 / acre min, if it was here and in a nonburn area, it would be in the $5000/acre area cause it all has to be chipped. If you have wet areas charge accordingly.

 

[Deas Plant]

You did WHAT????????????

Hi, Dozer 575/D8Bob.
Quote:
"If you have to stack to burn then you need the excavator, a good dozer guy can do that too." Unquote.

The man has a 41B and a D8K, along with a few other toys and makes at least a part of his living with them so there is at least a fair chance that he can handle them so why would anyone post such a dumb comment as that?

Quote:
"I did 30 acres in a week one time and that was with 2 to 3 foot fir stumps all logged first." Unquote.

You did WHAT??????????????

Post the photos, please. WOTT?????????? NO photos?????? Again????????

You have been thoroughly discredited almost every time you have posted on this forum, quite often by me, so why would anyone, especially me, start believing you now?

Hi, 41B.
Without wishing to dampen your enthusiasm for the idea of chaining that piece of country, chaining is at its most economical on bigger jobs 'cos you have to transport TWO dozers AND the chain to the job and then away from it again. Sure, it might be fun to set yourself up with a chain between the D8K and 41B but, unless you already HAVE the chain, you would have to source and probably pay for one. You would then have to get it to the job and that will also cost one way or another. Then, after you have finished the job, you would likely have to haul it away again. More cost.

For mine, you would be better off spending the $2 1/2 G. on the rake and clearing it with the dozers. If the bigger trees prove to be a bit stubborn, use the D8K and Kelly pick to soften them up for the 41B to knock down. It might be worth going round and doing that before you put the rake on the 41B as the blade will both be stronger and - most likely - lift higher than the rake.

Once the big stuff is down, get one of those big suckers in front of the blade of the 41B and just push it up and down that piece of land until everything on it is FLAT. That way, you could be cutting/flattening maybe 3 times the width of the bare blade in each pass. Then you can rake and burn it with no fuss or bother.

If the trunk of one of those bigger trees is long enough and heavy enough, you might want to cut the root ball off and maybe some of the limbs so that it lays flatter on the ground. If you use this method, while you are doing the flattening, you might like to have the D8 standing by to push the already downed bigger trees out into the flattened areas as you come to them so that they don't get in your way with the dozer and log.

Hope this helps.

 

[special tool]

Are there any wet areas? If not that should be an easy job, gosh wish I could land something like that. The right guy on a properly equipped D8 should be able to do it in 12 days or so. With dozers I would have one rough clearing and the other cleaning and pushing piles. If you have to stack to burn then you need the excavator, a good dozer guy can do that too. 2 good dozers and guys should have it done in maybe 7 to 8 days. As long as all goes smooth no break downs, no other problems. As long as the ground is good and its just those trash trees. Both dozers with a good clearing head, good solid clearing blade with teeth like a beals. I did 30 acres in a week one time and that was with 2 to 3 foot fir stumps all logged first. Just a D8 with a splitter on rear and that includes cleaning the debris real good for a chipper.
A union guy probably won't work hard at it and with all your costs, time frame etc.
$3000 / acre min, if it was here and in a nonburn area, it would be in the $5000/acre area cause it all has to be chipped. If you have wet areas charge accordingly.

30 acres full of 2-3 foot stumps - just you and a D8 for one week?
Wow, that's working at a fantastik pace.

 

[Deas Plant]

Doubt????????????????

Hi, Special Tool.
Surely you are not doubting the great, the one-and-only, the HIGHLY (self)-esteemed, Dozer 575?

You MUST be noo here. LOL. We older members all know the value of Dozer 575's statements - like the time he informed us categorically that you could not push trees with a track loader 'cos the angle of push - or dangle, or somesuch - would cause the bucket to slide up the tree rather push the tree over.

ROFLMAO.

Obviously, very few if any track loaders have read "The World According To Dozer 575."

Please excuse me for a wek or two while I convluse with mirth.

 

[fiat41b]

Hello Deas and others on board last night i stayed up late looking at old state letting bid tabs found some close comparisions on tree clearings one had 53 acres it was at
1st bidder 4000.00 and another was McAninch 3300. but these jobs were not done in jan-feb or had these strong completion dates on the clearing because they were hiway jobs that also had million yds on them with a completion date 1year or more im sure they burned the trees cause i worked for a different contractor w/gps d6r on a different section they had and they burn also.

 

[Deas Plant]

Set-up costs.

Hi, 41B.
The fact of having large earthworks to follow the clearing greatly reduces the set-up costs 'per unit of work', so to speak. Those companies were going there to do far more than just the clearing so their set-up costs were spread over much more work. You would be going in to do just the clearing so you need to factor your set-up costs to suit.

One more reason why I think the two bigger dozers are the way to go, especially if you can get that trick with the log to work. I did a bit of clearing back in the early 1960's using a Cat D4 2T series dozer pulling a log behind it in a similar fashion to what I suggested in pushing the log ahead of you. It about tripled the width of each pass. We cut grooves around each end of the log, shackled chains in those grooves and had the other ends of the chains coupled to the D4's drawbar so that the log was being dragged behind the little dozer at right angles to it. It worked like a dream in light to medium scrub. Quite often, all that was needed to get it ready for plowing was a running fire over the flattened scrub and then plow it. Easy.

 

[OneWelder]

I have some concerns about the rooting process -if you have a lot of hard frost
there was a few company's in in N. E. that bid jobs so cheap that the only way for them to make money was to prevent their subs from finishing on time -then collect the penalties
check their reputation
Hope you get job and all goes well

 

[OneWelder]

My concern is that if it is cold, after you disturb the ground the frost will go in deep

 

[special tool]

Hi, Special Tool.
Surely you are not doubting the great, the one-and-only, the HIGHLY (self)-esteemed, Dozer 575?

You MUST be noo here. LOL. We older members all know the value of Dozer 575's statements - like the time he informed us categorically that you could not push trees with a track loader 'cos the angle of push - or dangle, or somesuch - would cause the bucket to slide up the tree rather push the tree over.

ROFLMAO.

Obviously, very few if any track loaders have read "The World According To Dozer 575."

Please excuse me for a wek or two while I convluse with mirth.

Oh shoot...that's right, I remember that about the loader.
This is the same guy?

Are we sure that this guy is not an internet "troll" looking for attention, because now it looks like there is a trend of absurd posts.:beatsme

 

[Deas Plant]

One and the same.

Hi, Special Tool.
Yep, one and the same, variously known as D8Bob, Dozer 575 and another handle or two that I have forgotten. Also world renowned for bashing Cat high sprocket drives - ad nauseum, like a broken record - and spouting the, to others un-noticed, virtues of 'Kummagutsa' dozers simply 'cos they DON'T make high sprocket drive crawlers.

Over a good number of years now, he has laid claim to having done all sorts of work, mainly with Cat D8H's and K's, but has so far failed to post a SINGLE, SOLITARY photo of any of the jobs he lays claim to having done.

By far the great majority of his posts are either difficult to believe, deliberately stirring the pot, or both. Sadly, some of what he posts is either dangerous or very close to it. I won't let him get away with any of that and one or two others here have blown him out of the water a time or two as well. I see you caught on to that latest claim pretty quick too.

 

[nextdoor]

Your like an elephant with totall recall Deas.

 

[nextdoor]

:stirthepot:If all else fails you could always use the axe, I hear with the right operater you could get 30 acres a week!!!