No start Bobcat E35

[Snowbird]

Looking for any thoughts on what to check next.
I have a 2011 E35 with a Kubota D1803 engine. I purchased this unit used in the fall of 2022 and did the 1000 hour service and etc... Has always started on the first half a crank until a few days ago on a job. I went to start it up and started to crank but the error exclamation indicator cam on and interrupted the key start. No code just the error light. Turn key off and back on just repeats the result.

What I have done:
It was giving me the 250hr service message so I reset that.
Checked all the fluids, looked for obvious things.
I suspected the shutoff solenoid so I unplugged it and tested both the start and hold and could hear it click. So while forcing the solenoid open with the start coil and jumping the starter the engine started and ran as normal as long as I give the solenoid power.

I also disconnected the battery for a while to reset any fault in the ECU

I'm sure I can remove it from it's current lawn ornament function on the job site but would really like to get to the bottom of what fault is causing
the issue any thought would be of help

Thanks, Dan

 

[uffex]

Good day Dan
Do you have a electrical schematic for the machine, if you can post we can try to help you.
Kind regards
Uffex

 

[Snowbird]

Thanks for your reply, no I don't have a schematic, I bought the Service and Workshop manual and thought there would be a schematic but I guess you purchase the wiring diagrams separate and I have not found one available. I'm surprised that with the fault/error light on there is no code, unless I just don't know how to get the code to appear.

 

[uffex]

Good day Dan
I have one which I guess is from an earlier model, does the attached match to your machine?
Kind regards
Uffex

 

[Snowbird]

Thanks Uffex, Kubota does use a common rail injection system so the schematic is close. I know the fuel system works fine the engine runs normal when I force the fuel shutoff solenoid open. So I'm dealing with an electrical problem. Today I'm going to check out the start relay but if that doesn't result in a fix I'll have to force the solenoid and try to load it on my trailer to get her to my shop.
Thanks, Dan

 

[uffex]

Good day Dan
It sounds as if you have a pull & hold device. Try the attched.
Kind regards
Uffex

 

[uffex]

Sorry Dan
Incomplete

 

[uffex]

Good day Dan
I have checked out the information from the schematic I have see my notes attached.
Kind regards
Uffex

 

[Snowbird]

Thankswell Uffex,
Really appreciate , . Here's a quick update;
I know the pull and hold solenoid well from my Kubota tractors. So after I checked the fuses and replaced the relay to no avail I unplugged the solenoid, gave it a ground and then 12v to pull and left the hold on while I jumped the starter with the key in the on position. The Fault light was on but Everything functioned normally. I was able to drive it out of the work area and on my trailer and back to my shop. Shut it down by removing the hold 12v wire.

Now I have no clue what the fault in the ECU is stemming from. There are no codes that show when I push the information button. With the fault on the ECU inhibits the solenoid pull and hold as well as the starter. Unless I can find some information on how to get the ECU to let me know what the fault is I may have to trailer to a dealer.

I really appreciate the schematics where did you find them?

Thanks, Dan

 

[uffex]

Good day Dan
I believe you have three wires going to the solenoid, the black is common ground. Dont ignore a quick continuity test often gets missed. The pulling wire should have twelve volts with a key on, the holding wire should have 12 volts when the motor is running.The pulling wire should be dead.
If I understand your post correctly, it is the holding signal that comes from the ECU that fails to arrive. When you make the pulling wire live you are able to start the engine. I suggest checking the coils in the solenoid.
According to the schematic you have a feed back signal but I am not sure where this arrives visually.
We often help owners out to fix the machines. In that process we often receive schematics that is where the documents originate.
Kind regards
Uffex

 

[Snowbird]

Well it's a rainy day and I have time to dig deeper. I feel a little foolish but that's OK as long as I'm getting to the bottom of this.

I did look through the 1000 page DF maintenance manual and did find the correct electrical schematic, I completely missed this the first look. Earlier when I checked the fuses I did a sight through the top and missed one that was blown. It was a 25amp and of course it is for the pull circuit. I didn't have a 25 but had 20 and a 30 so I put the 20a in and all was back to normal (I'll get a 25a and replace). BUT I still don't know why the fuse blew. It only services the pull coil and sends a signal to the ECU. So back to the solenoid to carefully check the pull coil. I know that presently it is not drawing enough current to blow the undersized 20a fuse so we may have a intermittent wiring issue. I'll investigate further but at least I have it in my shop where I can take my time.
Uffex, thanks so much for taking the time for me.
Best regards, Dan

 

[uffex]

Good news Dan
At least you have a runner, if you bottom out the fuse issue come back with the information.
Kind regards
Uffex

 

[Snowbird]

I certainly will Uffex, One big Issue for Bobcat is that the ECU got the lack of signal from the pull relay when the start relay kicked in, turned on the fault light but did not send out to the console an error code. That is frustrating for anyone working on these units.

 

[uffex]

Good day Dan
If the fuse blows make first to disconnect cable and check for shorts to ground, it is possible to bypass the ECU if you need we have the information on file. Any photo's you are able to provide are real helpful.
Keep smiling
Uffex