Question about water.

[CM1995]

Here in the south we have been going on a 2 year drought. We have seen very little rainfall this summer and it has compounded last years deficient rainfall as well. I have been through a few "droughts" but none like this.

The problem is having sufficient water to meet optimum moisture for compaction. Up until May of this year we had a meter to pull water from the fire hydrant but that has been taken away. Luckily we have had some rainfall and our permenant and temp. retention ponds have water in them which we have been pumping into the water truck. Now we are heading into our rainy season but Sept. and Oct. are usually dry. Earlier in the summer and prior to the few showers we had, we were pulling water out of a nearby quarry - had to swap topsoil for water but that is another story. Pulling water from the quarry pretty much 1/2 our water delivery compared to being able to pull out of the hydrant/ponds - which pretty much 1/2 our production.

My question is to the guys that work out in the arid regions of the country: What do you guys do to get water?

We are considering drilling a jobsite well. It would be beneficial not only during construction but the common area sprinkler systems could use it as well.

I haven't been through this before - we are usually fighting too much water.

 

[Bob Horrell]

We have a similar problem here in Southern California. Last year was a record low for rain. About 5 of the last 7 years have been far below average. So far I have been OK because I have two sources of water from water hauling companies in the area that have really good wells. If their wells go bad, I don't know what I would do.
Are there any water companies in your area you could work with - maybe make some kind of contractual arrangement? Or anyone with a good well that would sell you water to haul at a reasonable price?
Here, I can get 4000 gal of water (if I haul it) for $15, and it costs between $70 and $80 per 4000 gal to have it hauled (depending upon distance). I have it hauled since the guy is dead reliable and will do a good job of spreading it for me. It just isn't worth my time to haul it myself. Good luck with your situation. The guys that win are the guys that get creative when these things happen.

 

[Construct'O]

Here in the south we have been going on a 2 year drought. We have seen very little rainfall this summer and it has compounded last years deficient rainfall as well. I have been through a few "droughts" but none like this.

The problem is having sufficient water to meet optimum moisture for compaction. Up until May of this year we had a meter to pull water from the fire hydrant but that has been taken away. Luckily we have had some rainfall and our permenant and temp. retention ponds have water in them which we have been pumping into the water truck. Now we are heading into our rainy season but Sept. and Oct. are usually dry. Earlier in the summer and prior to the few showers we had, we were pulling water out of a nearby quarry - had to swap topsoil for water but that is another story. Pulling water from the quarry pretty much 1/2 our water delivery compared to being able to pull out of the hydrant/ponds - which pretty much 1/2 our production.

My question is to the guys that work out in the arid regions of the country: What do you guys do to get water?

We are considering drilling a jobsite well. It would be beneficial not only during construction but the common area sprinkler systems could use it as well.

I haven't been through this before - we are usually fighting too much water.

We have a lot of ponds around that could be used for water.

Here now you have to have a permit to dig a well.Good luck:usa

 

[surfer-joe]

Water for dust suppression is usually always a problem in arid regions, and now, with states insisting on even tighter particulates control, it's beginning to become a very, very expensive problem.

Some of the expense comes in having to have large water retention structures and tanks in which you can store enough water to fill your equipment in a timely basis without having to wait on a long fill-up period using a 2" hose off a hydrant or a small water pump. Stand-tanks are expensive. Some guys are using what amounts to an above-ground pool being fed off a hydrant, with a hurricane water screw or a Crissifulli pump feeding the water truck or whatever.

Almost anything less than a ten or twelve inch fill-pipe is very time consuming and costly as your operator and equipment sit hooked up for twenty minutes or more waiting to top off, while more water equipment is waiting their turn in line.

You can use brine, which if there is oil and gas production in your area is sometimes readily available. In central Michigan, it flows freely in some places and in others the petroleum people are happy to get rid of it. But it can't be used every where because of environmental reasons.

You can ad chemicals that make water wetter. In other words, the chemicals change the Ph of the water to make it easier for the liquid to penetrate the soil you are working with. This is where it begins to get costly again. You can also ad enzymes, which make water wetter, but also die off and bind soil molecules together when they do. There are other conditioners that help somewhat, one is based on a byproduct of molasses. Smells like hell tho! Used to be you could use waste oil or diesel fuel, no longer.

Also used to be you could flop a 4" pump and standpipe down anywhere without anyone saying a word. No longer the case. Have to have permits and permissions from everyone including a note from your mother. Local contractor here is drawing water from the CAP canal between here and Phoenix. Has to block off a lane in each direction of a four-lane highway with barricades and signboards. Has to have a flagman for loaded trucks entering traffic. Has to take all the barricades and stuff down at the end of shift and put them back up in the morning. I notice his 4" pump is equipped with a meter, so he's getting nicked at so much a thousand gallons I suppose, or acre-feet.

You have to use smarter equipment that directs the water to just the area you need to have covered. Conservation if you will. No more just spray hell out of everything, use water wisely. Keep those areas needed damp, don't let them dry out if you can help it. Pre-wet if allowed and you have the resources to do so. Collect any site run-off and re-use if you can. Some sites are required to have no off-site drainage, so make use of that.

Some of these methods and additives will corrode and ruin your water equipment if not used carefully. You need to clean the exterior of your water trucks and water wagons often and perform extensive PM on the piping, valves, pumps and controls. Avoid using anything with pipe threads if possible, use flexible joints and clamps with rubber seals, (Vic-Traulic type). Less leaks and easier maintenance too. Avoid pumps with the old packing gland type stuffing for sealing. They leak too much, remember, any water you leak off your equipment isn't going where you need it. Some state DOT's forbid any water leakage now.

It doesn't take a genius to see that some areas are going to run out of water for construction purposes soon. At that point the state will have to take a stand and say no more permits for dust control and construction. We who are already here in this area are being asked to conserve on a personal basis so that more people can move into the area and have some water. What's the point? At some time and soon, there simply will not be enough water to go around and then what?

I probably missed some ideas that others on the forum will pick up on.

Good Luck!

 

[CM1995]

Thanks for the thoughts and comments - very informative as usual.:thumbsup

Hi Bob, it is interesting about the water companies that haul water to your site. In these parts the only water company is the one you send your $25 bucks to every month. So these guys are basically water "subcontractors" that will deliver a load of water and disperse it for you - never thought of that. You used to not see many water trucks around here at all. We just didn't need them to make compaction. Water trucks were mostly used to wash the mud off the streets and haul water for hydroseeding.

Construct'O - yeah we have been searching the private ponds around the site but the people are reluctant to let us have any. I can totally understand - I wouldn't want my pond dry if we don't get any more rain. We have one deal worked out with a guy that wants to muck his pond out. He will let us pump all the water out but we have to rent a long reach excavator to muck it out. I am hesitant to put a machine on private property and thus are searching for other alternatives.

Surfer Joe - Thank you for the info on the inner workings of the water equipment. To be honest I do not know much about water trucks, their pumps, plumbing, etc. We are planning on making a purchase of a 4000 gal truck (we are renting the 2000 gal) nothing fancy just in good working order. If I find a truck that meets our specs and budget, I may PM you for advice if you don't mind.

As an ironic side note to my thread, it is currently raining outside - I hope we are getting some at the project.ointhead Tomorrow the crews will be chasing water and mending erosoin control. Next week we will be searching for water - man you gotta love the smell dirt and diesel fuel to be in this business!:Banghead Sometimes I think I have lost my mind.

 

[surfer-joe]

If ya want to make a million bucks in the dirt contracting business, start out with ten million.........

 

[LowBoy]

If ya want to make a million bucks in the dirt contracting business, start out with ten million.........

That's always been the saying in the trucking business too..."If you wanna make a million dollars in the trkg. business, start off with TWO..."

 

[Loaderman380]

Here in Florida we have been pretty dry as well (until this week, we have had rain every day). Luckily we are working a large site (1,600 acres) with many retention ponds and have had no shortage of places to pump from. The trouble on this site isn't where to get the water, but getting it where we need it, we need more water trucks.

 

[CM1995]

If ya want to make a million bucks in the dirt contracting business, start out with ten million.........

That's always been the saying in the trucking business too..."If you wanna make a million dollars in the trkg. business, start off with TWO..."

Now that is the best advice I have heard all day!:lmao :lmao :lmao