Thoughts on D6T track wear

[dribster]

Hi,
I’m looking at purchasing this 2008 D6T XL serial number LAY00822 from a machinery dealer for a property tractor. Current machine hours are 14488. The machine seems tight, minimal movement in nose code, trunnions, equaliser seems alright, but this is some marking on the machine chassis that I did notice that I would like to be commented upon. The main reason for the post is for thoughts on the track wear. I have a CAT CTS Percent Worn track report done at 14000 hours, so 486 hours ago. I have attached photos of the track rails, sprocket segments, top rollers and underside of track showing the bushings. I have attached photos from the LH side of the machine with wear to the chassis by the equaliser bar at some time. There doesn’t seem to be excessive movement, so whether this was done previously and fixed up I have no idea. The machine wasn’t able to be put on any sort of angle to really test the equaliser bar truly and determine. There is a couple of leaks. One on the LHS final drive outside and one running down the inside RHS. I have also attached the CAT ET report on the machine. Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated.

 

[dribster]

More photos

 

[dribster]

More photos

 

[Nige]

The ET Product Status Report is far too "clean". Someone has been in there and cleaned all the Diagnostic Codes & Diagnostic Events. Fine if you are just taking delivery of the machine because you know everything that appears has happened during your ownership but it does not you give any clue as to what might have happened before the machine came into your hands. Note: To erase ALL Diagnostic Events and some Diagnostic Codes requires Factory Passwords so on the face of it a dealer must have had "hands" on it in order to do that.

Not sure about the wear in the chassis rail above the E-Bar because the D6T does not have resilient blocks to control maximum E-Bar angle like the larger tractor models. Did you have a crawl underneath to have a look if anything appeared "off".?

The leaks could be from the Duo-Cone seals in the final drives from standing. How long has it been in that location without moving.?

I would’ve thought working in soft ground with lots of dirt buildup between the chassis and the track frames would cause the paint to be rubbed off the areas shown in your photos. There isn't a lot of clearance between the track frames and the chassis as they oscillate.

With close to 15k hours on all the powertrain components right from the engine back to the final drives unless they have been overhauled aready you might be in for some telephone-number-size repairs if anything fails catastrophically. From the CTS report I would say the undercarriage is the last thing you need to worry about.

 

[dribster]

Nige,
I could have plugged the laptop in and checked it out, but thought it was pointless because it had already been cleared. The salesman is an ex CAT fitter, so probably had the contacted inside to clear all codes etc out of the ECM. There is not a lot of history on the machine. By the sounds of it, nothing major has been touched. I have attached the SIMS report.
Thanks for your thoughts so far.

 

[Nige]

In that case and depending on how many hours/yr you plan on running it you really ought to make some long term budgetary provision for component overhaul. We had 6 x D6T LAY on our fleet and all the powertrain components were replaced on a planned before-failure basis at 12-14k.

 

[dribster]

Thanks for the insight in those six LAY D6T’s you ran Nige. The price he wants is definitely with a COVID tax placed on it and about $30000 above where it would have been pre COVID. I’ll have to get some pricing on some rebuilds.

 

[ahart]

I’d be trying to find out if you can acquire SOS history on the machine. If none is available, I’d insist on a full sample draw being done on the machine after it’s been exercised and fluids are warm. Won’t tell you everything but it will give you some idea of the condition of components. Any of those components could be making metal right now and you’d never know it.

 

[John C.]

Those oil leaks appear to be coming from the pivot shaft seals.

I see oversized track bushings in the photos but the report shows 52% wear while the rest of the undercarriage seems to average 30% wear. Makes me thing the machine was used on steep ground with a lot of reverse operation.

The equalizer bar can be checked just by pushing the blade into the ground and lifting the front of the machine. Watch each end of the bar for movement as the weight of the machine is lifted off the bar. It should move as the front of the machine moves. If it doesn't, the machine has problems.

 

[dribster]

Thanks for the info John. There was slight movement in the nose cone and equaliser bar as I lifted the weight off the front of the machine. Nothing excessive, but slight movement. I think the machine has spent the 500hrs since the track report done working in sand, Thanks for all the replies so far, it is much appreciated.

 

[Nige]

There was slight movement in the nose cone

Depending on what you mean by "slight" you might be OK. How much movement does it have.? If the pins and bushes are in good condition there should be no movement at all on the hard nose. Any movement on those pins could potentially take the radiator out in short order due to vibration.

 

[dribster]

Nige, to the naked eye, let’s say between 5-10mm movement when the blade was pushed to the ground

 

[Nige]

Nige, to the naked eye, let’s say between 5-10mm movement when the blade was pushed to the ground

If that movement was on the pins and depending on the accuracy of your estimate that’s probably about 3-8mm too much IMHO.

 

[dribster]

definitely untrained eye there Nige, but it looked to be about that nose moving to the rest of the bonnet, the rubber cushioning strip between the nose and the bonnet was a little pushed out on the LHS

 

[Queenslander]

dribster, one option might be to get Cat to do a TA2 inspection.
At around AU$2000 it could be considered pricey but Nige may be able to tell us if it is money well spent or not

 

[Vetech63]

Thanks for the insight in those six LAY D6T’s you ran Nige. The price he wants is definitely with a COVID tax placed on it and about $30000 above where it would have been pre COVID. I’ll have to get some pricing on some rebuilds.

15K hours, no history, 30K over normal retail? That would be a huge gamble …...Hard pass for me.

 

[Nige]

As I said before it's the lack of component overhaul/repair history that bothers me. Based on 14k+ hours (provided that's true) everything on that tractor from the radiator to the final drives and everything in between should have already been overhauled by now.

I like ahart's suggestion of getting a set of oil samples from the machine, but to reiterate the samples would need to be taken with all the systems at normal operating temperature to be of any value.

At around AU$2000 it could be considered pricey but Nige may be able to tell us if it is money well spent or not

When the seller is asking AU$30k (US$20k) ABOVE normal retail a TA-2 @ $2000 would be a bargain, especially if it proved that the condition of the machine was not as the seller is describing.
A lot would depend if the dealer a) would do it at that price and, b) whether or not they had manpower to do it in a reasonable time frame.

 

[John C.]

If there is any movement on the hard nose at all it will need pins and bushings. I've seen them move about an inch total before the fan starts hitting the fan guards. I've had people just pull the fan guards out and keep running. Problem is that at that point the bushings are worn through and the pins are riding directly on the machine frame. You know you have problems with the hard nose and equalizer bar and may have a issue with both pivot shafts. All that work to repair is likely around $15,000US and you then still have to look at the tracks and sprockets. No bargains to be found in that machine at all.

 

[dribster]

Hi all, thanks for the great advice that you all given and it is much appreciated. I’ll have to look at a few more things and make a plan moving forward.

 

[.RC.]

Thanks for the insight in those six LAY D6T’s you ran Nige. The price he wants is definitely with a COVID tax placed on it and about $30000 above where it would have been pre COVID. I’ll have to get some pricing on some rebuilds.

Queensland cattle farmers are loaded with money at the moment so prices for anything and everything that farmers could buy is through the roof.

eg: this sold this week https://www.tvaa.com.au/auctions/13595/lot/16757-1979-Caterpillar-140G-Motor-Grader
and a car that would have cost about $50 000 brand new in 2006 sold for $74 000 https://www.tvaa.com.au/auctions/13595/lot/17185-2006-Toyota-Landcruiser-RV-HDJ79R-Utility


Does the machine have over 3000 idle hours on it as per the ad?