Kubota U27 and small jobs question

[Crkr_East]

I currently run a plumbing business and normally we rent small excavators for trenching and such. Recently the idea of buying a 3 tonne mini came up. We want to haul it around with our dump trailer and drum up some smaller style jobs.

We have been looking at the Kubota U27 and I was wondering how capable of a machine would this be for small stuff such as land clearing, stump removal, grading, driveway renewals, etc and are these jobs enough to justify such a purchase without having to go bigger in size.

 

[Welder Dave]

For digging narrow plumbing and electrical trenches it would be a good machine. Land clearing and stump removal? You've got to be kidding!

 

[Crkr_East]

Hmm that’s odd on the land clearing and stump removal. Before I read this I saw a fellow post a lot clearing and stump removal with a Wolf 26E which is a brand I’ve never heard of before but from my understanding is a cheaper Chinese brand. Surely something as notorious as a Kubota could handle that as well.

 

[Welder Dave]

A 3 ton machine isn't going to dig out very big stumps or clear much land. I think it would struggle with a 6" stump and roots.

 

[BC Placer gold]

Light clearing and stump removal can be done with a small unit, but it will be very time consuming and puts the operator and machine in very close to your work (think safety concerns).

I have a lot of hours on that size machine, a couple of years ago I used a Hitachi ZX27 to open up an access trail in rough country through several landslides. The largest was 300' in length on a steep side slope and contained large incorporated fir and birch trees. Although it was doable it took 50 machine hours....(as well as a fair bit of chainsaw work). Any Douglas fir root larger than 3" will be a problem. Some larger stumps had to be left for when we came through later with our 21 ton excavator (one grab and they are out...)

Kubota's are good strong machines, we put 600 hours on a KX040. Are you able to legally haul a slightly larger machine? The 3.5 ton class, or 5 ton?. Have you considered a U-35? good specs and short tail swing with an increase in reach/weight (important!). We currently have a Deere 50D and it has enough weight and power to deal with decent sized trees, and will break through roots that stop a 2.7 ton.

We have done a lot of test trenching with the 2.7- 5 ton machines and for that work they are excellent. Low environmental impact, fast and efficient!

 

[MG84]

If you could step up to a 3.5 ton machine it would be a lot more capable. I can dig out most any size stump with my Kubota U35-4, and it will lay down trees up to 16-18" diameter with reasonable ease (experienced operator, wouldn't suggest that to most people.) With that being said, time to complete the job is where size/power really come into play. My 3.5 ton mini ex will do it when called on, but a larger machine is faster and safer.

I've dug out large stumps (30"+) with a machine the size of a U27 when that was all that was available, or would fit, but your looking at a 2-3 hour job instead of a 30min job. Then the other problem is the machine isn't big enough to get the stump out of the hole, so it takes a lot of finagling, digging ramps, etc to even move the stump. As for land clearing, a U27 could safely handle trees 6-8", maybe 10" in diameter with an experienced operator. As mentioned, the reach isn't much so you are working right in your face when pulling out brush, etc.

A U27 would be great for plumbing/electric/cable trenching in confined areas, small retaining walls, landscaping/small hardscaping, footers in confined areas, etc. I would not advertise it for land clearing or stump remove unless the jobs were either very small or that size machine is all that would fit.

 

[BC Placer gold]

Agree ^^^^ with all of the above. I think the U35-4 would be a great choice, in hindsight I would have picked it over the KX-040. Near the same capabilities but zero (or very close to it) tail swing and as a bonus no DPF to deal with.

 

[Crkr_East]

Light clearing and stump removal can be done with a small unit, but it will be very time consuming and puts the operator and machine in very close to your work (think safety concerns).

I have a lot of hours on that size machine, a couple of years ago I used a Hitachi ZX27 to open up an access trail in rough country through several landslides. The largest was 300' in length on a steep side slope and contained large incorporated fir and birch trees. Although it was doable it took 50 machine hours....(as well as a fair bit of chainsaw work). Any Douglas fir root larger than 3" will be a problem. Some larger stumps had to be left for when we came through later with our 21 ton excavator (one grab and they are out...)

Kubota's are good strong machines, we put 600 hours on a KX040. Are you able to legally haul a slightly larger machine? The 3.5 ton class, or 5 ton?. Have you considered a U-35? good specs and short tail swing with an increase in reach/weight (important!). We currently have a Deere 50D and it has enough weight and power to deal with decent sized trees, and will break through roots that stop a 2.7 ton.

We have done a lot of test trenching with the 2.7- 5 ton machines and for that work they are excellent. Low environmental impact, fast and efficient!

Right now I have a brand new 1500 gmc so hauling that looks to be out of the question. I will eventually move to a 2500 just didn’t feel the need a few months ago but now I’m wishing I did. A lot of our work is commercial service work so trenching for us is not a money maker outside of renting. As long as I can make money off the machine I don’t mind getting a U27 and just paying attention to the limits of the machine. I can always upgrade to bigger down the road.

 

[BC Placer gold]

Can you legally haul a 27 with a half ton? Just make sure and scale the setup to confirm....this will avoid any nasty (and expensive) surprises with the CVSE.

If so then a U27 can still do a good amount of work, with the limitations that have been mentioned...
As you say you could always upgrade the towing set up later. We found the 2.7 tons held their value and were pretty easy to re sell later on as most anyone can haul the unit.

 

[CM1995]

Welcome to the Forums CEast! Glad to have you.

What type of commercial plumbing service work do you do? Fixture swaps and repairs or more involved?

The reason I ask is if you had a mini would it be prudent to go after more underground plumbing work? Here at least plumbers can name their price on sewer and water services - residential or commercial.

 

[Tugger2]

Ive had a 303.5 Cat for over 10 years. I do a lot with it because its what i have. Excavated and did the servicing for my shop. Cleared a few acres of my own land and done lots of stump removal for neighbors. With patience and care with the machine ive done 2ft fir stumps. Its no way to make money ,but sometimes its the only way to get into a job. I built a single point ripper for my excavator,that was agame changer for stumping.

 

[Crkr_East]

Can you legally haul a 27 with a half ton? Just make sure and scale the setup to confirm....this will avoid any nasty (and expensive) surprises with the CVSE.

If so then a U27 can still do a good amount of work, with the limitations that have been mentioned...
As you say you could always upgrade the towing set up later. We found the 2.7 tons held their value and were pretty easy to re sell later on as most anyone can haul the unit.

if I remember correctly I can haul the U27 with a 7k dump trailer and be within the limits.

 

[CM1995]

Its no way to make money ,but sometimes its the only way to get into a job.

Couldn't agree more. Sometimes we use what we have to do a personal project but couldn't make a living charging others for the same.

I can dig a basement with a shovel..

 

[Crkr_East]

Couldn't agree more. Sometimes we use what we have to do a personal project but couldn't make a living charging others for the same.

I can dig a basement with a shovel..

I mean I have a main business but I don’t like buying $$$$ equipment unless I can make money off it. At the very least enough to pay off the machine. I’d be lying if I said I would never use it on my own land because it is one of the reasons it came up. If I can make 10-20K/year from it I’d be alright. On the same side, I’d also want a capable machine but that means bigger truck, bigger trailer, etc.

 

[CM1995]

See my post #10 above.

 

[Crkr_East]

Welcome to the Forums CEast! Glad to have you.

What type of commercial plumbing service work do you do? Fixture swaps and repairs or more involved?

The reason I ask is if you had a mini would it be prudent to go after more underground plumbing work? Here at least plumbers can name their price on sewer and water services - residential or commercial.

Sorry i didn’t see this.

Repairs, replacements, new construction for REITs filling new tenant spaces, in floor hot water heating systems, some HVAC work. We do residential sometimes but this is our bread and butter.

 

[BC Placer gold]

Ive had a 303.5 Cat for over 10 years. I do a lot with it because its what i have. Excavated and did the servicing for my shop. Cleared a few acres of my own land and done lots of stump removal for neighbors. With patience and care with the machine ive done 2ft fir stumps. Its no way to make money ,but sometimes its the only way to get into a job. I built a single point ripper for my excavator,that was agame changer for stumping.

Your ripper looks really well built, and I can see how that would really improve stumping ability while putting less wear and tear on the machine.

 

[Tugger2]

Your ripper looks really well built, and I can see how that would really improve stumping ability while putting less wear and tear on the machine.

Thanks ,i enjoy building things like that when i have the time.

 

[Acoals]

A machine that small is a good plumber's or electrician's tool, but not really much for general work. If you can add on extra tasks on a job you are doing plumbing on, great, but otherwise you are better off sticking with plumbing and not trying to mess around with stumps and other dirt work with a little machine like that.

Do your rental costs equal what the payment on the machine is going to be? How many years of renting will you have to do before you would have spent the cost of the machine?

 

[Crkr_East]

R

A machine that small is a good plumber's or electrician's tool, but not really much for general work. If you can add on extra tasks on a job you are doing plumbing on, great, but otherwise you are better off sticking with plumbing and not trying to mess around with stumps and other dirt work with a little machine like that.

Do your rental costs equal what the payment on the machine is going to be? How many years of renting will you have to do before you would have spent the cost of the machine?

i mean the value of the machine as a company asset more than makes up for it.