Why haven't scrapers evolved very much ?

[Construct'O]

Haven't had it on a job yet, not much doing here. I'm supposed to be helping with both 623's on a water treatment job but they keep pushing the date back because of permit issues. Now they say Feb. Have not needed a dozer either, the 8K's are still in my yard I could rent one back if needed. I saw an 07' D6R EROPS, 6s, ripper , sweeps & screens W/ 960 hours go for $170K at Ritchie Bros. Not going to take that step until work opens up. Gettin good at sittin on butt

I was just wondering how things have been.You need to at least try your new machine out ,if nothing else practice a little on the back forty.

I have been busy all years and have work to do,but here the weather has been terrible since this time last year.

Foot of frost here and more on the way,so i'm setting also.I do farm work and can't fight the frost ,plus never made any money doing it ,always costed me in the long run.

Have had a pretty good year,but if not for the bad weather it could have been a awesome year.

Don't know about the new year,but have backlog of work because of the weather.Just hope they don't change there mind come spring.

When you get things rolling post a few pic of your new scraper moving dirt.:usa

 

[637slayer]

where i work they have put a little satelite antena on the cabs of our scrapers, its tied into the onboard computer, lets some one know of idle times over raps i think pretty much everything its doin or not doin, the g even reports load count. i heard a boss hassling an operator about a transmission red flag on his computer, it was from going from n to 8 without having the brake depressed, so in some cases a good evolution in other cases a not so good evolution

 

[Gavin84w]

Cat recently put out a booklet titled "Debunking scraper myths" and this gives a very good insight where Cat is heading with there line. They actually see them as a growth product for the future and are aligning them technology wise with other Cat lines and bring out new H series models across the board in the next few years. With the urbanisation of other parts of the world plus the lack of supply of trucks for mining the scraper is finding a bit of reception and a re-emergence in some countries. The big issues are ride and operator training and a fantastic simulator is very close to release to address this issue along with some new ideas for ride and comfort.

 

[637slayer]

i think it was burnout who said he has seen an h model 27, i looked on cat.com didnt find anything. ide like to see some pics. they cant make running one any easier, with the joystick, and trany p for park and d for drive, running one just gets easier and easier, but no matter what technology does to the scraper operating one will still take some experience. sometimes i get to run a 37d model against a 37g and 37e2s its fun for a day or two, they might be more comfy and have better stereos, but the d has paid for itsself 100 times over and at $800,000 the g cant haul anymore dirt. i know the g is burning less fuel and is more reliable i just chuckle to myself knowing that the 35 years that separates the two machines they are still so much alike, for the h i would put the g model cab and controls on an e2 scraper, and position the cab back to the e2 position, when they moved the cab 2 feet over for the g i think they messed up the balance.:my2c

 

[ronnie]

I guess I have spent time in modern combines, tractors and trucks and I see huge differences between them and scrapers.[/QUOTE scrapers are just fine the way they are the y were built to go in places that even an off road truck can't go wit hout a big road all you need for a scraper is a road in a good oper. will make his own road out the yare'nt built to make a fashion statement they are ugly and tough and will out last a truck when the truck is at the bone yard with a small crew of wrench bender's and rockets scientest tryin to figure out what happened to it the scraper wit hit's rough ride will still be going

 

[Deas Plant]

Evovlement?????????????????

Hi, Someguy.
Have you ever operated a cable-controlled LeTourneau LP scoop behind a Cat D8 1H, 8R or 2U crawler with slidebar transmission?

Funny thing but I notice that most of the 'evolovement' that you have mentioned as taking place with combines and farm tractors has also taken place with scrapers - more horsepower, bigger bowls, better cabs, a/c, stereo radios, stereo CD players, pressurised cabs, computerisation(??????????), improved(?) controls, GPS, laser monitoring and control, etc., etc..

And what about the cushion hitch that has been mentioned above? Doesn't THAT count as evolvement? If it doesn't in your book, I betchya there are a few scraper operators here who would disagree with you.

What more do you want? Maybe an exercise machine so that the poor down-trodden, ill treated, under-worked, over-paid operator doesn't get fat and lazy while spending 10 - 12 hours a day flat on his fat butt in the air-ride, suspended-cab seat, listening to his favourite heavy metal rapper band?

The basic shape hasn't changed much because it hasn't NEEDED to change to do its job very efficiently and effectively and if it ain't broke, why fix it?

There have been some variations from the original/conventional scraper. That's why we now have elevating scrapers and scrapers fitted with augers for elevating and twin-power scrapers and push-pull scrapers. You might like to try a Google search for 'hoeing apron scraper'. Have you ever heard of that jigger? (Since you seem to need some 'eye-opening' exercise, I'll leave you to do the legwork on that one.)

Scrapers have also been hooked up in tandem and even as triples with ONE operator. Ever try doing THAT with 2 or 3 combines? And just for chuckles, in my days on wheat farms, we had 1,000 bushel trailing bins alongside the harvester/combine with the harvester/combine emptying into the trailer via an auger as you worked so that you could harvest for longer and stop less. And THAT was in the EARLY 1960's, in a little, backwoods, under-privileged, un-developed country called Australia, way down there almost on the butt end of the earth. LOL.

Without wishing to put you down, may I suggest that you do a little more research before posting questions like this in the future. The information is all out there if you will but look.

 

[crayton]

Someguy, might I suggest you go to the library and check out "Mover Of Men And Mountains" by R.G. LeTourneau. A good look into the mind of a very smart man who started out as a farmer and dirt stiff. He spent a lot of time in the seat but instead of daydreaming he was thinking all the time. Also a man who in his minds eye could see what had to be done and then went ahead and did it. It is really unbelievable what that man accomplished in a lifetime. He did more with an eight grade education than all the smart ones with their Harvard MBAs trying to run this country will ever accomplish.

 

[Meangreen]

Hi, Someguy.
Have you ever operated a cable-controlled LeTourneau LP scoop behind a Cat D8 1H, 8R or 2U crawler with slidebar transmission?

.

Yeah......and you prayed that you didn't have to go all the way over yonder to low reverse first thing on a cold morning.

 

[DPete]

Heh heh, you forgot to mention when one strand of cable wears through and bunches up inside a sheave block and all you have is a hammer, bar and cable cutter to get her goin. I'm young enough that I missed the 2U's but spent many an hour on a 14A cable scraper, dozer. I don't forget changing draw back springs either on Cat scrapers, what a job. Come to think of it I'm lazy as hell now from all the progress.

 

[Turbo21835]

Im only 26, but ive done my fair share of apron cables on a TS14B. Its not a bad little project. Most of the time you can do it yourself, but occasionally you cant get the cable wedge out. Our 14s usually had an extra apron cable or two with them. Favorite storage location was on the front in front of the grill, zip tied to the machine.

 

[Someguy]

And what about the cushion hitch that has been mentioned above? Doesn't THAT count as evolvement?

The cushion hitch on the 627 has been there since the early days. There hasn't been much improvement in ride quality since. Rock trucks have suspension. TS24Bs have nitrogen shocks. Has Cat put any suspension under its scrapers ? Nope.

I've heard that ejector cylinders can be damaged if one happens to load with them extended. Is there a warning system to alert an absent minded operator ?

The 627 cab is the same size it has always been. Does it have a trainer seat ? Nope. The noise level is rated at 80.5 dB.

The sight lines on scrapers aren't great. Can you see into the bowl when loading ?

I love how the tach in the new 627s will show the RPM of one engine, either the front or the rear. How about putting 2 needles on the tach and let the operator see the speed of both engines ?

If the new scrapers are so much better than the old ones, why is everyone keeping their old iron ? Before you say the cost of buying new is too great, farmer generally run newish combines and tractors and you put way less hours on them in a year than you do a scraper.

 

[Mass-X]

Someguy, how much seat time do you have in a scraper?

 

[Someguy]

I grew up with scrapers. My family ran a large road construction company. I left that scene and now I am being asked to come back.

 

[Mass-X]

Don't beat around the bush, answer my question. How many hours have you spent in the seat of a scraper?

 

[roddyo]

Seat Time in a Scraper

Someguy, how much seat time do you have in a scraper?

My guess is about 2 minutes sitting in a new one at the Dealer.

 

[Turbo21835]

Don't beat around the bush, answer my question. How many hours have you spent in the seat of a scraper?

Im going to figure less than 100.

Hes probably the guy you have to go rescue after sliding off the side of a stockpile. Dont get me wrong, ive been there myself, but that was many moons ago, and I have since learned a few trucks from the old indians

 

[Someguy]

Nice attitude, guys. It wouldn't matter how many hours I told you guys I had because you'd come on and criticize it. Fine. So be it.

 

[Mass-X]

If you don’t like what other people’s posts have to say, than don’t read them. That's the beauty of an internet forum. You need a little thicker skin if you’re going to participate in online debates on a forum, let alone survive on a big dirt project.

You stated in another post, “There is a lot of experience on this board. I'm trying to learn as much as I can…” There is no better way to learn than through a debate, but you won’t get anywhere if you cut and run when things get a little hot.

I’ve been watching your posts this week and refrained from posting because of the obviousness of your lack of experience. The ambiguity of your screen-name coupled with a barrage of vague questions from someone we’ve never seen post before doesn’t do much but put off a lot of people in this community. But I figure since I’ve got some free time, I might be willing to get into this debate with you, but first I want to know how much time you’ve actually spent pulling a can lever?

So answer the question, and we’ll go from there.

 

[Steve Frazier]

Someguy, I came very close to asking a similar question of you last week when you started the "What is your edge in business?" thread. Veterans who have been in the business for a while are pretty good at sniffing out B/S. I've never been involved with scrapers and am curious about your experience in the field. Mass-X has offered an opportunity for you to explain this, it might help members form answers for you. If you choose to alienate yourself I'm pretty sure a number of very experienced members will choose to ignore you.

 

[ronnie]

give some ideas on how to inprove the best dirt moving machine on 4 tire's