• Thank you for visiting HeavyEquipmentForums.com! Our objective is to provide industry professionals a place to gather to exchange questions, answers and ideas. We welcome you to register using the "Register" icon at the top of the page. We'd appreciate any help you can offer in spreading the word of our new site. The more members that join, the bigger resource for all to enjoy. Thank you!

Upfitting an International 4700

MG84

Senior Member
Joined
Jan 6, 2023
Messages
683
Location
Virginia
I recently picked up a nice 2000 International 4700 with a DT466E/Allison MT643, with what I'll call a 14' stake bed for lack of better term (see my other thread on the bed if interested). Truck is 32K GWVR, air brakes, A/C, cruise, radio, everything I wanted except an air ride seat (which may come later.) I'm beginning the process of upfitting the truck for my construction business and farm. It's primary use will be a tow vehicle with the ability to haul materials/tools/equipment on the bed. For the time being I'm leaving the bed as-is, but may modify it down the road. The 3000lb lift gate has already proved to be quite handy. First order of business is a hitch, then tie downs, front recovery points, fix the tool boxes, etc. Here's a pic of the truck when I bought it:
00j0j_4CaUYLFDpDK_0CI0t2_1200x900.jpg

As to the hitch, here is what I'm starting with:
IMG_08232.jpg

Plan to weld on a plate for a pinlte hitch and 2" receiver. Since it'll be a lot of out of position welding and I'm not very good at stick I think I'm going to pick up a Hobart Handler 140 wire welder (maybe a Lincoln would be better?). I realize these are pretty critical welds so I'm going to practice with it plenty before attempting to weld the plate on. I'll post up some more pics as I get it done.
 

PeterG

Senior Member
Joined
Apr 14, 2015
Messages
480
Location
United States
Occupation
Contractor
Nice truck! You should find a shop that specializes in doing Heavy truck welding and fabrication, and update to LED tail lights etc. Are you running air to the back for an air brake trailer?
 

Attachments

  • Rear quater view of Dump Truck.jpg
    Rear quater view of Dump Truck.jpg
    1.5 MB · Views: 13

MG84

Senior Member
Joined
Jan 6, 2023
Messages
683
Location
Virginia
Alright, alright, I'm just messin' with yall on the MIG welder, I figure no thread on the matter is complete without the obligatory "Can I weld a 1" butt plate hitch on my Tri-axle with my 110v Harbor Freight flux core welder?" question. My feeble attempt at humor lol.

To put everyone's mind at ease, I actually have about 25yrs experience stick welding. The butt plate was notched to sit inside the frame, edges beveled, and preheated before welding. All welding was multiple pass and done with my Miller Dialarc 250 AC/DC, set on DCEP, fresh E-7018 rods from a hermetically sealed package.


So back to the hitch plate itself. It's 3/4" thick and I had a local industrial fabrication shop cut the basic shape with their CNC laser table. Saved me a lot of torch work and gave me nice clean edges for welding. I drilled the holes for the trailer plug and pintle mounting holes, everything else was cut on the CNC.

Drilling the larger holes on my mill, hole saws work great if you spin them slow, plenty of cutting fluid, and relief holes to let the chips out:
IMG_0820.JPG
IMG_0821.JPG

Hole saws are surprisingly accurate:
IMG_0822.JPG

More to come...
 

materthegreater

Senior Member
Joined
Jul 25, 2012
Messages
707
Location
VT
You will likely find the 466/Allison combo pretty anemic for towing any amount of weight unless you're always going downhill. What is the 466 set at?
 

MG84

Senior Member
Joined
Jan 6, 2023
Messages
683
Location
Virginia
I need to edit these pics down in size, I realized they are pretty large in size and MB, these should be better.

Frame all cleaned up and test fitting the plate. Its a heavy devil, used the forks on the skid steer to support it while I slid it in place:
IMG_0826sm.jpg

Didn't take too many pics while I was welding, was pretty busy took 8lbs welding rods. Oh, and I did use a MIG welder for the tail light brackets :p
IMG_0837sm.jpg

Added this little loop at the frame to clip on the breakaway lanyard for electric brake trailers:
IMG_0836sm.jpg

Pintle hitch itself is going to be a 60,000lb swivel type, have the same one on another truck and really like it. This truck will probably never see half that weight. Trying to make this truck as easy to use an productive as possible so I'm designing in the features I like from other rigs I've seen or owned. Got the hitch painted, pintle mounted, and lights wired up last night but haven't got any pics yet. Need to finish the trailer plug wiring and add electric brake controller then it'll be ready to tow. Truck currently doesn't have air to the rear, I can always add it later if I get an air brake trailer. I'll post more as I get it done, thanks for everyone's replies.
 
Last edited:

MG84

Senior Member
Joined
Jan 6, 2023
Messages
683
Location
Virginia
You will likely find the 466/Allison combo pretty anemic for towing any amount of weight unless you're always going downhill. What is the 466 set at?
Oh believe me I know, it's 190hp. I'm in no hurry and my left knee will thank me for the auto trans lol.

That does bring me to a question for yall, what do I need to know to get the most out of this Allison automatic? Never owned a truck with one before, this one seems to do everything it's supposed to, but I have only driven it empty. When should it be shifted manually? Should I add an auxiliary cooler? What type of fluid does it take and what are the service intervals? Probably will have more questions once I start using it, I don't have any service literature or even an owners manual yet.
 

MG84

Senior Member
Joined
Jan 6, 2023
Messages
683
Location
Virginia
Use some 90* brackets from frame to tail board hitch plate and bolt to frame. Hate seeing
hitches welded to frames. Just MO.
I honestly don't think I've ever seen a class 6-8 truck where the hitch wasn't welded to the frame. Why do you prefer to not weld them?
 

MG84

Senior Member
Joined
Jan 6, 2023
Messages
683
Location
Virginia
Nice truck! You should find a shop that specializes in doing Heavy truck welding and fabrication, and update to LED tail lights etc. Are you running air to the back for an air brake trailer?
That dump truck is setup well, lots of nice features. I might steal the idea of the fold up ladder.
 

PeterG

Senior Member
Joined
Apr 14, 2015
Messages
480
Location
United States
Occupation
Contractor
Looking good! I like to have a separate smaller D-ring just to connect the trailer brakeaway cable to.

Amber flashing lights are also great. Not only for your protection around the truck, but so you can park anywhere. If you double park and just put on your blinkers, then your just getting people mad. Put on your amber flashers, and now your the Utility Company fixing something important and they couldn't care less.
 

cfherrman

Senior Member
Joined
Jun 3, 2022
Messages
1,871
Location
Hays, Kansas
Oh believe me I know, it's 190hp. I'm in no hurry and my left knee will thank me for the auto trans lol.

That does bring me to a question for yall, what do I need to know to get the most out of this Allison automatic? Never owned a truck with one before, this one seems to do everything it's supposed to, but I have only driven it empty. When should it be shifted manually? Should I add an auxiliary cooler? What type of fluid does it take and what are the service intervals? Probably will have more questions once I start using it, I don't have any service literature or even an owners manual yet.

Never shift the auto manually unless there is some sort of problem, manual shift leads to extra heat because you might be running the torque converter unlocked.

They only time I change from 5 is when I'm going slow in hilly terrain so I get some engine braking, I just use truck brakes and drive appropriately so I don't have to use them too much. When you get in the electronic Allison's they engine brake like crazy.

Make sure you have a trans temp guage, never go above 250 unless you plan on changing the transmission immediately after. I'd even keep it under 230-240.

Make sure the shift modulator is in good shape, that one should be electric.

I'm used to 750's that have separate cooler and filter ports but the busted truck I have with 653 has a small filter and a air to oil cooler on one loop, I'd definitely recommend doing something like this.

With clean fluid, correct level of fluid, and not overheating the trans they are pretty happy.

There is probably a max gvwr on the 653 somehow or somewhere so don't plan on putting a massive trailer behind it.

I use 15w40 in my 750's but that because of stationary power applications and the heavy duty use. It should have atf in it and probably put that in there, if you have problems maybe go up to 15w40.
 

Truck Shop

Senior Member
Joined
Dec 7, 2015
Messages
17,229
Location
WWW.
I honestly don't think I've ever seen a class 6-8 truck where the hitch wasn't welded to the frame. Why do you prefer to not weld them?
A properly built dump normally has a fabricated/formed drawbar. If at any time one decides to
opt out of what the truck is used for and repurposed again then you get to cut it all off. When I
built trucks for AG use I built a full flat crossmember that was flush with end of frame and bolted
the hitch plate to that.
 

PeterG

Senior Member
Joined
Apr 14, 2015
Messages
480
Location
United States
Occupation
Contractor
My Kenworth T800 uses the 5-Speed push button Allison Auto.
On my international 4900 it's a manual 4-Speed Allison Auto with high/low rear axle. I shift up and down manually all the time watching the RPM's. I switch to the rear transaxle Low if going up or down something super steep (usually up or down a residential access road or driveway) when fully loaded. Otherwise it's a bit of a manual when towing heavy or loaded fully.
 

CM1995

Administrator
Joined
Jan 21, 2007
Messages
13,466
Location
Alabama
Occupation
Running what I brung and taking what I win
I honestly don't think I've ever seen a class 6-8 truck where the hitch wasn't welded to the frame. Why do you prefer to not weld them?

Pretty standard practice here for the dump bed manufacturers and upfitters to weld a pintle plate to the rear of the frame.

2024 KW county truck up for sale at JM Wood


OX is one of the largest bed manufacturers in the Southeast.
 

Truck Shop

Senior Member
Joined
Dec 7, 2015
Messages
17,229
Location
WWW.
May be there but not if I'm doing it. Lynnwood made a nice kit for pintle hitch so did Pierce.
 

cfherrman

Senior Member
Joined
Jun 3, 2022
Messages
1,871
Location
Hays, Kansas
My Kenworth T800 uses the 5-Speed push button Allison Auto.
On my international 4900 it's a manual 4-Speed Allison Auto with high/low rear axle. I shift up and down manually all the time watching the RPM's. I switch to the rear transaxle Low if going up or down something super steep (usually up or down a residential access road or driveway) when fully loaded. Otherwise it's a bit of a manual when towing heavy or loaded fully.

Never heard of a manual Allison except for a few examples, would like to know more
 

PeterG

Senior Member
Joined
Apr 14, 2015
Messages
480
Location
United States
Occupation
Contractor
Not sure which one is mine. Truck is a 1990. I will check which model. Has a handle that is move up and down.
  • Allison AT transmission—AT540, AT542, AT543, AT545 (4 speeds) - seen in buses I believe
 
Top